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Federal Politics

Election wrap: August 13, 2013

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Another day, another vote. Let's look back on the day that was:

  • Treasury and the Department of Finance released the pre election economic and fiscal outlook;
  • it showed the books were pretty much in the same state as they were when Labor released the economic statement last month and the budget in May;
  • Labor says the Coalition now has no excuse not to release its policy costings;
  • the Coalition disagrees and will not say when that day might come (but it will be before September 7);
  • Mr Abbott announced a $100 million mobile phone black spot polic (in a mobile phone black spot which made it hard to get the story out); and
  • Mr Abbott described the Liberal candidate for a western Sydney seat as having "sex appeal".

Thanks to everyone who read and contributed to the discussion about the campaign. A large round of applause - as usual - for Alex Ellinghausen and Andrew Meares.

See you in the morning people.

 

 

 

 

That's it for the leaders' campaigns today.

Mr Abbott and his caravan are headed for the airport at a 5pm flight headed for goodness knows where.

Media travelling with Mr Rudd have also been told that is it for today.

The Coalition's assistant treasury spokesman, Mathias Cormann, says Mr Abbott's remark about candidate Fiona Scott was "clearly a light-hearted comment".

"I'm sure he meant no offence," Senator Cormann told Sky News.

 

Speaking of Julia Gillard here is an account of her final 24 hours as prime minister written by former Victorian Labor minister Mary Delahunty.

It originally appeared in the Good Weekend magazine but sometimes the links to those pieces are a little hard to find on the Fairfax Media weekend websites.

I can finally put to bed the issue of when MPs who are not standing for re election can be described as "retired" (see 2.01pm and 11.24am posts).

The office of the serjeant-at-arms (the presiding officer for the House of Representatives) has confirmed that "members who are not standing for re election cease to be members at the date of dissolution of the House, ie 5 August".

 

My, my, my how things have changed.

Imagine if Julia Gillard was still prime minister.

Do you think Labor would have let Mr Abbott off so lightly?

Makes you wonder how genuine all that stuff about gender and misogyny was, doesn't it?

Labor campaign headquarters has issued the following comment in relation to Mr Abbott's "sex appeal" comments (see 3.07pm post).

"Mr Abbott's comments are entirely a matter for Mr Abbott," a campaign spokeperson said.

 

Breaking news reporter Judith Ireland has filed this story on Mr Abbott's "sex appeal" comment.

Opposition leader Tony Abbott and Liberal candidate Fiona Scott in Penrith, NSW, on Tuesday.

Opposition leader Tony Abbott and Liberal candidate Fiona Scott in Penrith, NSW, on Tuesday. Photo: Alex Ellinghausen

The most excellent Andrew Meares has filed this behind the scenes look at what happens before Kevin Rudd makes his speeches.

Prime Minister Kevin Rudd during a Click to play video

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Waiting for Kevin

Fairfax photographer Andrew Meares has been following the Prime Minister Kevin Rudd on the campaign trail. Here's a look at what happens before the speeches are made.

PT1M47S http://www.canberratimes.com.au/action/externalEmbeddedPlayer?id=d-2rtlk 620 349

In this photo you can see Mr Abbott meeting the Penrith Panthers. On the far left of the shot is Fiona Scott who is the Coalition's candidate for Lindsay (which she is hoping to take from Labor frontbencher David Bradbury).

Lindsay used to be held by Howard government minister Jackie Kelly.

Mr Abbott was asked about the similarities between Ms Scott and Ms Kelly: "They're young, they're feisty. I can probably say have a bit of sex appeal and they're just very, very connected to the local community."

 

Opposition leader Tony Abbott meets with Penrith Panthers players, in Penrith, NSW, on Tuesday.

Opposition leader Tony Abbott meets with Penrith Panthers players, in Penrith, NSW, on Tuesday. Photo: Alex Ellinghausen

I do feel sorry for calorie conscious politicians on the campaign trail confronted as they are by all manner of food they would normally never eat.

Poor Mr Abbott partook of not only ice cream but juice last week.

Today it was a sausage. But at least he appears to have gone for an Atkins type variant on the traditional sausage sizzle - sausage only, hold the bread.

Opposition leader Tony Abbott in Penrith, NSW, on Tuesday.

Opposition leader Tony Abbott in Penrith, NSW, on Tuesday. Photo: Alex Ellinghausen

Mr Abbott is on a western Sydney blitz.

He has just unveiled an Abbott western Sydney campaign bus and spoken in glowing terms of all the Coalition's candidates in the area.

One by one he went through the resumes and achievements of candidates, Jonathan Swan reports, until he got to Jaymes Diaz who Mr Abbott described as "professional from western Sydney".

Mr Diaz, you may remember, attracted a lot of attention last week when he surprised everyone in the Coalition by announcing it had a six point plan to stop boat arrivals but was then unable to say what they were.

Mr Diaz is running in the seat of Greenway which is held by Labor's Michelle Rowland with a wafer thin margin of 0.9 per cent.

Jonathan reports that Mr Diaz avoided further scrutiny by making a quick dash for a car immediately after the event.

 

Opposition leader Tony Abbott in Penrith, NSW, on Tuesday.

Opposition leader Tony Abbott in Penrith, NSW, on Tuesday. Photo: Alex Ellinghausen

In the 12.38pm post I did a fairly ham fisted job of telling you what PEFO means in terms of the numbers of boat arrivals.

Judith Ireland has done a better job so I'll quote her work:

"PEFO revises up the assumed rate of boat arrivals since the May budget. 15,600 people are now expected in 2013/14 - up from the 13,200 forecast contained in the budget."

Judith continues: "Treasury and Finance explain that PEFO retains the assumption that 1,100 people will arrive per month but has updated the figure to account for the impact of arrivals since the budget and revised estimates of the number of people being placed on bridging visas."

"The assumptions for the following three years are also higher."

"Despite Labor's hardline Papua New Guinea plan announced last month, PEFO says that retaining the arrival assumption of 1,100 a month is prudent."

"Mr Bowen backed thedecision not to reduce the boat arrivals forecasts, saying the government did the same with its economic statement released earlier this month."

Is nowhere in Australia free from gusty winds?

Prime Minister Kevin Rudd speaks to troops from the 4th Regiment at Lavarack Barracks in Townsville on Tuesday.

Prime Minister Kevin Rudd speaks to troops from the 4th Regiment at Lavarack Barracks in Townsville on Tuesday. Photo: Andrew Meares

Mr Rudd did not take questions from the media while at Lavarack Barracks. It was purely a picture opportunity.

Prime Minister Kevin Rudd meets with troops from the 4th Regiment at Lavarack Barracks in Townsville on Tuesday.

Prime Minister Kevin Rudd meets with troops from the 4th Regiment at Lavarack Barracks in Townsville on Tuesday. Photo: Andrew Meares

Small children and soldiers - tick off two photo opportunities for Kevin Rudd today.

Mr Rudd is at the Lavarack barracks in Townsville where he is visiting the 4th Regiment.

 

Prime Minister Kevin Rudd  with the 4th Regiment at Lavarack Barracks in Townsville on Tuesday.

Prime Minister Kevin Rudd with the 4th Regiment at Lavarack Barracks in Townsville on Tuesday. Photo: Andrew Meares

An update to the 11.24am post in which I set out to discover whether or not it is accurate to refer to outgoing MPs such as Tony Windsor as "retired".

I should have known it would be more complicated that I thought.

The Australian Electoral Commission informs me it is not an issue for them and suggest I go to the Sergeant-at- Arms office (the presiding officer for the House of Representatives).

Which I have done. Naturally an official email was requested. I obliged. I am waiting for a response.

The Age's economics editor, Tim Colebatch, has filed this analysis of the PEFO figures.

Tim writes that the figures are "a slap in the face for the Coalition" because they confirmed that "the numbers the government has published were the numbers prepared by the experts at Treasury and the Department of Finance".

This means, Tim argues, that there is no reason for the Coalition not to release its costings.

 

Worth keeping in mind as the outgoing independent MP for Lyne, Rob Oakeshott, points out:

 

The blank page being bandied about by Mr Robb is from the Treasury and Department of Finance which will now begin publishing costings of policies by Labor, the Coalition and the Greens.

(I should point out that there are no costings for any party on the site yet. You can monitor the site yourself here.)

The Coalition's money men, Joe Hockey and Andrew Robb, are attempting to turn the "show me the money" call back on Labor.

Finance spokesman Andrew Robb is holding up a blank sheet of paper to make his point.

"Your job is to detail costings and how you fund them and once you've done that you can start lecturing us," Mr Robb says.

Mr Hockey says the Coalition is just trying to keep up with the rules set by Labor.

It wanted us to use the Parliamentary Budget Office but we are waiting for them to get back to us, Mr Hockey says.

"Our costings are based on the best available figures from the Parliamentary Budget Office and a range of other figures," Mr Hockey says.

He promises to go through the figures "carefully, methodically, prudently".

Frances Abbott tiptoes to see her father, Opposition leader Tony Abbott, speak to the media during morning tea at Colo Heights, NSW, on Tuesday.

Frances Abbott tiptoes to see her father, Opposition leader Tony Abbott, speak to the media during morning tea at Colo Heights, NSW, on Tuesday. Photo: Alex Ellinghausen

Awwww - Frances Abbott was so keen to catch a glimpse of her father, Coalition leader Tony Abbott, during his press conference she stood on tippy toes.

Who is the candidate?

Opposition leader Tony Abbott and Frances Abbott depart after morning tea at Colo Heights, NSW, on Tuesday.

Opposition leader Tony Abbott and Frances Abbott depart after morning tea at Colo Heights, NSW, on Tuesday. Photo: Alex Ellinghausen

Margie and Frances to the rescue.

Opposition leader Tony Abbott with Margie and Frances Abbott at Colo Heights, NSW, on Tuesday.

Opposition leader Tony Abbott with Margie and Frances Abbott at Colo Heights, NSW, on Tuesday. Photo: Alex Ellinghausen

Opposition leader Tony Abbott meets with Joy Derrig and her 17 month old granddaughter Sophia Derrig during morning tea at Colo Heights, NSW, on Tuesday.

Opposition leader Tony Abbott meets with Joy Derrig and her 17 month old granddaughter Sophia Derrig during morning tea at Colo Heights, NSW, on Tuesday. Photo: Alex Ellinghausen

It's like a car crash in slow motion.

So when I get back to Point Piper I might take the sea kayak out for a paddle.

Opposition leader Tony Abbott and communications spokesman Malcolm Turnbull speak to media during morning tea at Colo Heights, NSW, on Tuesday.

Opposition leader Tony Abbott and communications spokesman Malcolm Turnbull speak to media during morning tea at Colo Heights, NSW, on Tuesday. Photo: Alex Ellinghausen

Whatever Labor says about the Coalition it cannot say its members do not cast shadows.

Coalition MPs Luke Hartsuyker, Philip Ruddock and Malcolm Turnbull join Opposition leader Tony Abbott on the campaign trail at Colo Heights, NSW, on Tuesday.

Coalition MPs Luke Hartsuyker, Philip Ruddock and Malcolm Turnbull join Opposition leader Tony Abbott on the campaign trail at Colo Heights, NSW, on Tuesday. Photo: Alex Ellinghausen

Is Coalition communications spokesman, Malcolm Turnbull, wearing (shudder) the type of glasses that tint when one walks into the sunshine?

Opposition leader Tony Abbott and communications spokesman Malcolm Turnbull at Colo Heights, NSW, on Tuesday.

Opposition leader Tony Abbott and communications spokesman Malcolm Turnbull at Colo Heights, NSW, on Tuesday. Photo: Alex Ellinghausen

Mr Bowen says the PEFO document has not revised the number of people expected to come to Australia by boat and seek asylum because it would not be "wise" to do so.

It's better to leave the forecasts as they are even though the government expects fewer people to arrive as a result of its Papua New Guinea plan, Mr Bowen says, because this makes it easier to keep track of spending.

Not surprisingly Mr Bowen uses the release of the outlook to demand the Coalition release its policy costings.

"From today the alibis end, the excuses end, [there's] nowhere to hide," Mr Bowen says.

"It's time for all parties to comply with the Charter of Budget Honesty as the government has been doing. From this day forward there's no excuses for the Coalition not to release its costings."

Treasurer Chris Bowen and Finance Minister Penny Wong are about to give Labor's response to this morning's PEFO findings.

Today's Fact Checker segment is now available in which which economics correspondent Peter Martin looks at Labor leader Kevin Rudd's claim that the GST could be changed without the states.

Peter's article is available here.

Peter also explains his findings and how he got to them in the below video.

 

 

GST - fact or fiction? (Video Thumbnail) Click to play video

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GST - fact or fiction?

Tony Abbott says he won't increase the Goods and Services Tax - but how easy would it be to hike the GST if he changed his mind?

PT2M47S http://www.canberratimes.com.au/action/externalEmbeddedPlayer?id=d-2rt43 620 349

Get thee behind me Malcolm.

Opposition leader Tony Abbott and communications spokesman Malcolm Turnbull speak to the media at Colo Heights, NSW, on Tuesday.

Opposition leader Tony Abbott and communications spokesman Malcolm Turnbull speak to the media at Colo Heights, NSW, on Tuesday. Photo: Alex Ellinghausen

Not again.

Opposition leader Tony Abbott meets with Joy Derrig and her 17 month old granddaughter Sophia Derrig during morning tea at Colo Heights, NSW, on Tuesday.

Opposition leader Tony Abbott meets with Joy Derrig and her 17 month old granddaughter Sophia Derrig during morning tea at Colo Heights, NSW, on Tuesday. Photo: Alex Ellinghausen

Readers will know I am a fan of political debates (although possibly a little less enthusiastic after Sunday night's offering) but not of the argy bargy that surrounds the organisation of them.

But I will put my jaded attitude aside to bring you up to date on where the next possible Kevin-Rudd-Tony-Abbott encounter is up to.

Mr Abbott would like to participate in a community forum with Mr Rudd hosted by Sky News.

"My view is that the journalists had a good go on Sunday," Mr Abbott said earlier today. "Journalists already have their vehicle for asking questions of me and Mr Rudd. It's time for the people to have a go."

However Mr Rudd wants to show up to a Channel 7 arranged affair this Sunday night which would involve copious use of social media.

Mr Rudd maintains a free to air channel is a better host because the numbers of people who have pay tv are relatively low.

 

In my 10.58am post I described Tony Windsor as now retired.

I notice people are asking if that's actually the case.

FYI - I have asked the Australian Electoral Commission to clarify the situation and will let you know what they say.

Mr Abbott is now being asked about comments made by WA Liberal MP Don Randall in today's West Australian newspaper.

Mr Randall said an incoming Coalition government might be forced to reverse some of its policy promises if the money was no longer there to pay for them.

"Particularly in the first part of their newly elected term, they find the circumstances may have changed or the finances - in the case both state and federal governments - have been eroded given the downturn in the Chinese economy," Mr Randall told the newspaper.

"You can't get away with it unless you communicate with the electorate and just to arrogantly announce things doesn't go down well with the electorate."

Labor has been having fun with these remarks today and is using them to say the Coalition is untrustworthy.

Mr Abbott has described Mr Randall as a one of the Coalition's "colourful characters" who "occasionally says some things that are wrong".

Mr Abbott: "I want to be known as someone who underpromises and overdelivers."

Remember how Mr Rudd wants Mr Abbott to release the Coalition's costings today (see 9.58am)?

Not going to happen (surprise, surprise).

Mr Abbott is back in range and reminding reporters that in 2010 Labor released its costings "at 5pm on the Friday before the election".

"We'll do a lot, lot better than that," Mr Abbott promises.

But not better as in today.

While we're on the topic of independent MPs - Tony Windsor is now the retired MP for New England (the seat is now likely to be won by the National Party's Barnaby Joyce).

But Mr Windsor is back in Canberra today cleaning out his office. Mr Windsor was spotted earlier this morning wearing a cheery red jumper and having a coffee at Aussie's, the Parliament House coffee shop. He will be having a farewell party tonight at a local pub well known for offering patrons the chance to cook their own steaks.

Bye bye Mr Windsor - a politician and a gentleman.

Tasmanian independent MP Andrew Wilkie (remember him?) is getting narky with Labor. They are running mean signs about him in his electorate. Imagine that.

Stick and stones and all that.

But given Mr Wilkie holds the Hobart seat of Denison with slim 1.2 per cent margin he can't afford to lose any votes. He feels signs saying "Vote Wilkie = Get Abbott" are misleading.

Breaking news reporter Daniel Hurst has more.

There is an extra $34 million in the coffers because the referendum on local government recognition will not proceed.

The document has provided some further insight into how much money the mining tax will raise for the government.

It's $0.7 billion this financial year, $0.8 billion in the 2014/15 financial year, $1.1 billion in 2015/16 and $1.8 billion in 2016/17.

Does it seem like the political pain was worth it?

Crack breaking news reporter Judith Ireland is on the PEFO case and leading our coverage of the numbers here.

So far no big surprises.

Let me provide you with some headline figures out of the PEFO report:

  • the economy is expected to grow by 2.5 per cent in 2013/14 and 3 per cent in 2014/15;
  • but this might change given the uncertainty surrounding international forecasts;
  • there will be a deficit of $30.1 billion in 2013/14 with a return to surplus in 2016/17 of $4.2 billion;
  • inflation is expected to ease; and
  • unemployment is expected to rise to 6.25 per cent in the June 2014 quarter.

But the Treasury and Department of Finance say it is difficult to be precise because of the uncertainty over China's growth and the declining contribution of resources to the domestic economy.

 

Wow - talk about timing.

Mr Rudd ended his press conference at pretty much the exact moment the PEFO documents went live on Treasury's website.

Prime Minister Kevin Rudd visited the Amaroo Early Childhood Centre in Townsville on Tuesday.

Prime Minister Kevin Rudd visited the Amaroo Early Childhood Centre in Townsville on Tuesday. Photo: Andrew Meares

Mr Rudd has announced another skills package.

Yesterday there was money for manufacturing workers to allow them to move from low-tech to high-tech industries.

Today it's $30 million over two years in training and improving the skills of 5800 extra workers in areas such as early childhood educators, nurses, allied health professionals, disability support carers and case managers.

 

Prime Minister Kevin Rudd at the Amaroo Early Childhood Centre in Townsville on Tuesday.

Prime Minister Kevin Rudd at the Amaroo Early Childhood Centre in Townsville on Tuesday. Photo: Andrew Meares

Mr Rudd is doing his pre PEFO press conference at a childcare centre in Townsville.

He is setting today as the deadline for the Coalition to release its election costings.

"It's D day for Mr Abbott when it comes to announcing his own budget bottom line," Mr Rudd says.

"Mr Abbott has been preparing for this election for three years."

Prime Minister Kevin Rudd at the Amaroo Early Childhood Centre in Townsville on Tuesday.

Prime Minister Kevin Rudd at the Amaroo Early Childhood Centre in Townsville on Tuesday. Photo: Andrew Meares

Oh the tricksiness of it all. The media travelling with Tony Abbott was told a short time ago they were going somewhere with no mobile reception which cued frantic calls/emails to head offices saying they would not be able to send any stories/photos/news of what was going on until after the fact.

Which raises the questions - what happens if you announce a policy but the media has no way of reporting it?

Just to make it weirder, Mr Abbott's staff have emailed media not travelling with him to say what he is doing.

It's a $100 million policy to address mobile phone black spots.

"You can't function without a phone," is the authorised Abbott quote sent out by his office.

"People must be able to stay in touch."

(Except the media travelling with him for the purpose of reporting on his announcements.)

A bit of numbers related homework.

Economics writer Matt Wade has a look at exactly what this PEFO malarky is all about. Basically, it's the mandatory election campaign budget prepared by the Treasury and the Department of Finance with no interference from the government.

Then treasurer Peter Costello introduced it as part of the Charter of Budget Honesty in 1998 after he found himself with a $10 billion budget black hole upon taking office in 1996.

But will its release force the Coalition to release its policy costings? Not on your nelly. The Coalition will argue it has to digest the figures, analyse them and think about them before it can show you the money.

The Age's economics editor, Tim Colebatch, has had enough. He writes: "Guys, the election is only 25 days away. You kept telling us you would explain how you would pay for it all in good time before the election. Time's up."

I guess it all comes down to what your definition of "in good time" is.

Let's keep the focus fiscal as we head towards 10am.

For the past week or so Labor has been running a scare campaign that a Coalition government would review the GST with a mind to increasing it and/or extending it to food. The Coalition has consistently denied, in the strongest terms, that it has any plan to do so.

(So much for Kevin Rudd's assertion that he wants to see an end to old style negative politics.)

Coalition education spokesman Christopher Pyne went the furthest of anyone in his party last night when he said the Coalition would "never ever" change the GST in "any" period of government.

You can read his comments here.

Do you believe the Coalition? You can have your say in our reader poll here.

The economic papers will be released via the Treasury website at 10am.

Leaders Kevin Rudd and Tony Abbott are expected to leave the initial responses to their respective money men - Chris Bowen and Joe Hockey.

Mr Rudd is in Townsville where he is visiting a childcare centre. He is expected to make some comments before the PEFO documents are released.

Mr Abbott has just landed at the Richmond air base outside Sydney. The media pack has been told its going somewhere with no mobile range. Something about the NBN possibly?

Happy PEFO day everyone - that's pre election economic and fiscal outlook.

So much love for numbers. Will the state of the nation's books prompt the Coalition to reveal its policy costings? What will they show about Labor's economic stewardship?

It's a pleasure to have your company as Andrew Meares, Alex Ellinghausen and I take you through the day.

Sort comments by:
  • It is so much better having PM Kevin Rudd on the campaign trail in place of gillard.

    But even now, female journalists are trying to shove gillard's photos in our faces non-stop.

    Just keep up the "poor julia gillard" antics female journalists and the entire Labor group will be ousted once and for all.

    Commenter
    Sharron
    Location
    Canberra
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 5:01PM
  • So now we can't say someone has "sex appeal"?
    Honestly some of you people need to take a good hard look at yourselves. Was the girl in question offended? If not, why should anyone else be?

    Commenter
    dRod
    Location
    Sydney
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 4:44PM
  • No word from the Handbag hit squad on Abbott's comment.

    Perhaps the squad died the day Gillard and McTernan departed.

    Commenter
    Tim of Altona
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 4:25PM
    • Nice work, Tim - trot out the disparaging gender-based epithet to excuse your foot-in-mouth idol of yet another ridiculous comment. And Fiona Scott is a complete lightweight - she's just lucky she's against Bradbury.

      Commenter
      BC
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:35PM
    • Not really needed Tim. Stupid comments like that speak volumes...

      Commenter
      pseudomys
      Location
      Melbourne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:36PM
    • Because people like you and the Murdoch press screamed blue murder every time someone dared mention that Abbott said things like "‘I think it would be folly to expect that women will ever dominate or even approach equal representation in a large number of areas simply because their aptitudes, abilities and interests are different for physiological reasons".

      At this point you either understand Abbott doesn't see men and women equally or you don't. Launching a big attack on this would just be a distraction from the costings issue. The Coalition would love it.

      Commenter
      Arky
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:39PM
    • BC,
      Do you mean David Bradbury, another one of the team that were $108b wrong in their forecasts over the past parliament....
      Assistant Treasurer!

      Commenter
      notlad
      Location
      Sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:51PM
    • Thank you for exemplifying the misogyny that undermined PM Gillard at every turn...some people probably didn't believe it was there until now.

      Commenter
      Peter
      Location
      sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 5:05PM
    • The Coalition's assistant treasury spokesman, Mathias Cormann, says Mr Abbott's remark about candidate Fiona Scott was "clearly a light-hearted comment".
      "I'm sure he meant no offence," Senator Cormann told Sky News.

      And therein lies the problem..he doesn't just get it.

      Commenter
      Peter
      Location
      sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 5:06PM
    • Mr Randall said an incoming Coalition government might be forced to reverse some of its policy promises if the money was no longer there to pay for them.
      "Particularly in the first part of their newly elected term, they find the circumstances may have changed or the finances - in the case both state and federal governments - have been eroded given the downturn in the Chinese economy," Mr Randall told the newspaper.

      Laying the groundwork for the inevitable liberal slashing, burning and taxing...and flip flop flapping and backflipping on pre election promises

      Commenter
      steve
      Location
      sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 5:11PM
  • The Sergeant at Arms answer makes no sense, as members do not have to re-nominate until after that date, so how can you possibly declare anyone a non-member until after the close of nominations!!!!!?????

    Commenter
    Norm
    Location
    Maroubra
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 4:17PM
  • When is the media going to wake up to the myth that big business is paying for the LNP's PPL scheme.

    The top 3200 companies will pay the same amount of income tax under the LNP and ALP. No more, no less.

    The LNP PPL scheme will be FULLY funded by taxpayers.

    Abbott's scheme is the equivalent of offering to shout a mate a beer, then asking him for the money for it when you sit down.

    Commenter
    Andrew
    Location
    Perth
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 4:15PM
  • Voters, "What the superior man seeks is in himself; what the small man seeks is in others" (Confucius).

    Commenter
    Pen of hrba
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 4:15PM
    • -If a man takes no thought about what is distant, he will find sorrow near at hand.
      -Even the greatest of whales is helpless in middle of desert.
      - Man who run behind car get exhausted
      *Confucious*

      Commenter
      Cwitty
      Location
      Sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:36PM
  • Because they have chosen to leave it so late, Abbott and Hockey have a mere 23 days (14 Aug to 5 Sep 2013) to release the costings for 200 policies they've lodged with the independent Parliamentary Budget Office (PBO).

    That's an average 9 policy costings to be announced each and every day for the next 23 days (even more for every day Abbott and Hockey delay).

    I forecast that the chances that we wont be seeing and scruitinising Coalition costings for their 200 policies in adequate time before the 7 Sep election will be 100%.

    Commenter
    Tristan
    Location
    Melbourne
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 4:12PM
  • "Makes you wonder how genuine all that stuff about gender and misogyny was, doesn't it?"
    Or maybe they just think the somments are so stupid that they stand on their own - they don't need to "go negative" because everyone will see them for what they are.

    Commenter
    Macca75
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 3:51PM
  • Oh surely we're not going to get a scare campaign about Abbott saying "sex appeal" for christ's sake.

    Commenter
    Alicia
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 3:51PM
    • I can hear the misogyny card being moved to the top of the deck as you write.

      Just under the GST on food, NBN, and Workchoices Revisited cards.

      Commenter
      Louis Cypher
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:01PM
    • One of the great paradoxes of politics is how those who scream loudest about the unfairness of being labeled misogynist are those most deserving of the description.

      Commenter
      Whyalla Wipeout
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:24PM
    • A scare campaign is not really needed Alicia. In moments like this, when he is allowed to be himself, we start to get a sense of the man behind the mask. Personally, I don't think these are the sorts of comments I want to hear coming from a potential Prime Minister.

      Commenter
      pseudomys
      Location
      Melbourne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:27PM
    • Abbott is so fearful of being labelled a mysoginist that he travels everywhere he can with his daughters in tow.

      Commenter
      Tom
      Location
      Canberra
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:27PM
    • Tom, one is MIA.

      Commenter
      A country gal
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 5:04PM
  • No, just shows that it's more effective to watch Abbott sink. You don't have to keep pointing it out makes you look childish. Let the media deal with it.

    Commenter
    Jitterry
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 3:50PM
  • Oh dear, Rudd has that worried look upon his face. That's what you get for telling porkies, Kev. Now tell us about climate change again.

    Commenter
    Pen of hrba
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 3:44PM
  • Labor has explained how its stuff is being funded, even if the Coalition disagrees with the Treasury figures. The Coalition has not even done this. Trying to pretend that both parties are in the same boat, lack of costings-wise, is incredibly disingenuous. It's not fooling anyone to wave around a blank page. It's not clever.

    Commenter
    Arky
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 3:38PM
    • The Coalition won't release its numbers because it hasn't yet found a dodgy accountancy firm willing to risk a serious reprimand from the industry body.

      Commenter
      Whyalla Wipeout
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:44PM
    • according to treasury Labor have not submitted any costings. None. Nada. Zip. It is all available on the website. No party has submitted any costings. When Labor put theirs up you might have an argument until then you've got nothing.
      "one rule for Kevin/Labor one rule for everybody else" #ThisIsLabor

      Commenter
      Cwitty
      Location
      Sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:44PM
    • its un believable stuff you lot and especially Fairfax actually want more of Labor! it amazes me you actually want a recession and more debt and the unemployment that goes with it and the less money availiable to buy news papers and therefore less jobs in your industry. I see it but its hard to believe!

      Commenter
      impy
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:53PM
    • Since when has the employment rate been linked to newspaper circulation, except maybe amongst neighbourhood youth. I look forward to seeing Alan Kohler's graph on that one.

      If you read the newspapers that are in circulation you might notice that we avoided a recession.

      Commenter
      tasc2
      Location
      Mornington Peninsula
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:03PM
    • Cwitty, I think you'll find that pefo has factored in the govt's spending that's what it's all about. Any NEW policy announcements that Labor announce will be a different matter and they will have to show costings.

      Commenter
      Mark C
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:03PM
    • impy, you may be better off getting your balance from the front page of Murdoch's Daily Terror (which presumes that its readership is too stupid and lazy to get beyond the cover). I'll stick with this paper.

      cwitty, the days of Oppositions submitting their costings to Treasury are passed, with the advent of the Parliamentary Budget Office.

      The real issue is that NOBODY, least of all the Liberals themselves, know how big the Hockeynomics black hole. And they are terrified of anyone, including themselves, finding out.

      Commenter
      whyalla Wipeout
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:29PM
    • There's a difference between "submitted costings" and "telling the Australian people how the things will be costed". Labor has done the second one and will now do the first one now that the PEFO is out. The Coalition haven't even done the second one, they're just still making excuses. And you'd better believe they have people looking at Labor's announcements and if there was any problem with the announced costings they'd be screaming about it.

      Commenter
      Arky
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:32PM
  • Rudd has rejected the offer for a debate on Sky on Sunday night. Why should the free to air chanels not get the chance to televise what the leaders are saying.
    Is Abbott running away from scrutiny?
    Is he now running scared, now the budget figures are out and he has no answer?

    Commenter
    poor voter
    Location
    melbourne
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 3:33PM
    • Think you are a bit confused here - Rudd is the one running away from the debate - he doesn't want to debate "audience" but wants to be questioned by journalists - doesn't want to hear what the ordinary person in the street really thinks of his govt.

      Commenter
      Baltic13
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:52PM
    • Sky has said a feed of the debate will be provided to free to air networks. Why won't Rudd face his own electorate?

      Commenter
      Nulla
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:56PM
    • A peoples debate is what is needed.
      Debate in front of an audience and then Questioin and Answer by the audience after.
      Although I would imagin Kevie will run a mile from that idea as it would scare the pants off him. Quivering bottom lip, the whole thing could happen again. He would probably prefer it be in a primary school class room with kiddies.

      Commenter
      Mal
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:05PM
  • We are yet to see anything substantively 'new' from Team Rudd. A few minor announcements here and there.

    Where is the big cornerstone announcement of the campaign from Labor?

    Adopting AMEC's plans for flow through shares for resources companies would be a start (even if the LNP match it, they can say it was 'theirs').

    Another one might be t come up with a clever way of harnessing the billions and billions of dollars tied up in super funds for infrastructure projects. Not just 1 or 2, but a $50-70b mega proposal that will really improve productivity.

    Commenter
    Anderw
    Location
    Perth
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 3:27PM
    • Rudd and his team are too busy story telling about the Coalition. That seems to be all they're doing in this campaign.
      It's the "New way" by the looks of it. Tales more tales and more tales.

      Commenter
      George
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:40PM
    • Oh dear, invest taxpayer super super in infrastructure and then charge them tolls for investing?

      Commenter
      Pen of hrba
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:53PM
    • I would be more than happy if my super fund could generate steady reliable income through building and operating new ports, new airports (Sydney airport anyone?) or public transport infrastructure.

      It could be done via a convertible bond in that it is interest paying debt (at the Gov't bond rate) for the construction and commissioning phase and then convertible into equity at the operational phase.

      Much more attractive than borrowing from German, Swiss and Chinese bondholders. At least the benefit would stay within the country.

      Commenter
      Andrew
      Location
      Perth
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:07PM
  • I think all this election campaigning is making Abbott a bit podgy around the belly. But what do you expect after eating ice creams, cakes, sugar cane juice, morning teas, afternoon teas. Although he does look happier after being exposed to all those treats.

    Commenter
    Sharron
    Location
    Canberra
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 3:21PM
  • Have you noticed there is a very pro Abbott look for the photo online for Abbott compared to Rudd. Rudd always appears back in shots, hair untidy whilst Abbott well posed ,good background. daughters well placed. Almost as if posed by Liberal machine.

    Commenter
    tashman1
    Location
    melb
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 3:12PM
    • Oh God you sound desperate!

      Commenter
      Fiona
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:30PM
    • Ahh. The whiff of a conspiracy.

      Perhaps the Abbott team has borrowed a faceless man?

      Or, the youthful imported American propaganda puppets?

      Maybe team Tony has borrowed a card from the Rudd\Gillard win at any cost deck?

      Commenter
      Louis Cypher
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:31PM
    • Now Andrew and Alex are involved in some sort of conspiracy that makes Abbott look more photogenic than Rudd. How dis you fit Murdoch into the conspiracy does he own Fairfax now?? Labor voters are truly priceless don't you ever change... precious #thisIsLabor

      Commenter
      Cwitty
      Location
      Sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:36PM
    • Maybe Abbott is better looking and fitter. Just a thought.

      Commenter
      Alicia
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:36PM
    • Over the last 3/4 hours if you look at the pics it is all Abbott. The news clip just posted was about the waiting reporters crowd.
      Was there a speech?. Just look at the pics Certainly someone is showing bias, whether the writer or back at the SMH. Maybe a rotation of photographers.

      Commenter
      just a worker
      Location
      Sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:46PM
    • Sorry tashman, I don't buy that. Alex and Andrew are first class photographers whose job is to get pictures that are interesting and meaningful.

      There are some photos today which are quite positive of Rudd, if you want to see them that way.

      I wouldn't get worried about quality photos in Fairfax when the largest news organisation by far in this country is using the news columns in all its mastheads in a blatant one-sided support of the Coalition at the behest of an internationally despised US citizen.

      Commenter
      Whyalla Wipeout
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:49PM
  • Concerned electricity consumer

    Rudd slashed at least $750 million from climate change programs to help cover the $4 billion bill for dropping the fixed ¬carbon price. The carbon price was supposed to be fixed at $25.40 a tonne for 2014-15, will instead move that year to the European Union floating price of about $6 to $10, costing the budget around $4 billion for one year. Legislation for the change will be presented after the election if Labor wins.

    Commenter
    Pen of hrba
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 3:06PM
    • Concerned Electricity Consumer,

      Tony Abbott and the energy providers have refused to guarantee that power bills will fall by 10% when Abbott removes the carbon tax and replaces it with his $720 p.a per average household, and $62 per tonne direct action on climate change policy - a policy which has been rubbished by his own party and which they are still agitating for Abbott to drop.

      As recommended by the Peter Costello led Commission of Audit in Qld which directly financially benefits clients of Costello's company ECG, Campbell Newman is in the process of a mass privatisation of public assets, including energy providers, contributing to hikes in Qld power bills.

      Commenter
      Tristan
      Location
      Melbourne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:17PM
  • Talk Howard and how good his surplus was is misleading. The reason why the libs had a huge surplus was because we paid excessive more tax.
    The libs lied and brought in the GST which has proved to be a double tax aimed at the low paid and saves big business from paying their fair share. So before you say how good they were do the sums.They lied last time about the GST and they are doing it again.

    Commenter
    Grey Nomad
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 3:04PM
    • Did you conveniently forget that the Libs took the GST to 1998 election - they were upfront with the electorate. Please explain how that was a lie? Another non comment from a rusted on ALP supporter.

      Commenter
      Pawel
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:25PM
    • We are not as stupid as you think, Grey? Howard went to the electorate for a decision on whether to have a GST or not, it was the electorate's decision to have a GST end of story.

      Yor reference to a double tax I assume refers to stamp duty etc, while it is true such taxes should have been dropped it was the decision of the States including Labor States to keep them not Howard.

      Commenter
      Pen of hrba
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:37PM
    • pawel,

      Did you conveniently forget Howard said 'never, ever'/ And your lot wonder why none of us believe Abbott's denials.

      The only thing that will stop Abbott and his backers jacking up the GST and including the food is a Senate that won't let it.

      That is the only reason why Howard took it to an election, and an election where his side actually got less votes and should not have won.

      Commenter
      Whyalla Wipeout
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:42PM
    • John Howard was re-elected leader of the Libs in 1995 and pledged "never ever" to introduce the GST

      Commenter
      Grey Nomad
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:43PM
    • Howard said 'never ever', changed his mind, and took it to election for the people to decide if they wanted the GST. The majority of the people voted for the Libs thus giving them a mandate to introduce the GST. Same can't be said for Labor and the Carbon Tax.

      Commenter
      Pawel
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:58PM
    • No, the 1993 election was the GST election and John Hewson openly campaigned on the policy and debated it extensively at every opportunity.

      The 1998 election was the Tampa children overboard lie election which Howard won with 49% of the vote.

      The Democrats were thrown out of office for supporting the GST and haven't been heard of since.

      Commenter
      Tristan
      Location
      Melbourne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:20PM
    • It's beside the point. The GST, which is the biggest tax in Australian history, was so complex at the time that no one knew how bad it was. People were so concerned about it that they put the Democrats in the senate to ensure that it only went through if they thought it was a good idea. Well, it was a bad idea, and the Democrats didn't do their bit, so got slaughtered and have never recovered.

      The GST is a regressive tax. Now that we know how regressive it is, the Labor Party have said that they will never increase the GST. The Liberal Party have never said that they will never increase it. Listen carefully to their wording.

      Commenter
      Tom
      Location
      Canberra
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:25PM
    • pawel, the majority of the people actually voted for Labor. It's just that the way these votes fell, it was the Liberals who got the most seats.

      Perhaps you might like to check the facts, rather than make whatever incorrect assumption suits your cock-eyed view of the world.

      Commenter
      whyalla Wipeout
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:32PM
  • Has anyone seen Wayne Swan? When will Rudd unleash the 'Worlds Greatest Treasure' to spruce the Labor message? The good people of Lilley MUST vote out this incompetent fool.

    Commenter
    Pawel
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 2:59PM
    • Swan's trapped in the same concrete bunker as other Labor luminaries such as Gillard, Latham, Thomson etc. He will be liberated after the election.

      I'm surprised you were able to post that comment. The modus operandi of the media is to pretend the last six years never happened.

      Commenter
      Nulla
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:03PM
    • "I'm surprised you were able to post that comment."

      I don't know why, Nulla. I don't think the moderators are required to reject comments whose only characteristics are stupidity and ignorance.

      Commenter
      Whyalla Wipeout
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:23PM
    • He could be visiting Jool's at her $1.8 mill new property in a swish Adelaide burb. Apparently it is an entertainers paradise. At least we know what she did with her pay hikes.

      Commenter
      Pen of hrba
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:29PM
  • It is becoming increasingly difficult understanding how anyone can vote for Labor or the Coalition. We have Rudd and Beattie on one side and Abott with Diaz on the other side? Really would anyone buy a car from these characters?

    Commenter
    Pen of hrba
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 2:57PM
    • Having been a car salesman much of my life I find your remark offensive

      Commenter
      Grey Nomad
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:09PM
    • can't believe I'm agreeing with you Pen, but it's true. I think I'd rather walk.

      Commenter
      pseudomys
      Location
      Melbourne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:27PM
    • Think you will find Diaz is a Candidate and not an elected member - whether he wins his seat or not is up to the people of his electorate - big difference

      Commenter
      Dave
      Location
      The Burbs
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:24PM
  • "Mr Rudd did not take questions from the media while at Lavarack Barracks. It was purely a picture opportunity."

    That pretty much sums up Kevin Rudd! He's only taking questions from primary school little-folks nowadays.

    Commenter
    notlad
    Location
    Sydney
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 2:55PM
    • Agree with you. For Rudd at least the school kids will not ask any difficult questions like at a people forum. I wish he would stop the nonsense of visiting schools it make hime weak that he cannot communicate with the 'voters'.

      Commenter
      Paul B
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:50PM
  • On the issue of PEFO’s do you recall what I wrote on 25/7 2013:

    “PNG is only 150 kilometres from Cape York across the Torres Strait with many islands for stop overs in between. These people smugglers will be setting up business in the Torres Strait as fast as the refugees are released into PNG society.”

    Surprise, it has already happened and happening. Are the people to be smuggled across the Torres taken into account, no I thought not.

    Since Tony Burke’s PNG policy announcement, 25 boats have arrived carrying 1809 passengers. Of those 118 asylum seekers have been transferred to Manus Island.

    Three weeks since the PNG policy was announced we had, 1809 arrivals if consistent this number equates to 31440 per year. However during two consecutive days last week we had 178 new arrivals, if this number remained consistent it equates to 32574 a year with a 3.06% increase?

    Commenter
    Pen of hrba
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 2:51PM
  • David Speers announced that they will host 2 more debates, one in Queensland and one in Sydney, both with the public being allowed to ask questions, Tony Abbott accepted these rules immediately, Kevin Rudd is now running scared saying he wants a panel of journalists (not the public) to ask the questions, obviously he wants his minions in the Canberra press gallery, Kevin, it’s time to face the people who will be voting, not the five year olds.

    Commenter
    Peter G
    Location
    Drummoyne
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 2:37PM
    • Peter G - surely that's not true. Didn't Kev say he'd debate Abbott anytime, anywhere, every week ?

      Kev's not running scared is he ?

      Commenter
      Hacka
      Location
      Canberra
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:54PM
    • I don't really get what Rudd is afraid of with People asking questions rather than Journalists?
      (Sorry journalists, yes you are people but not Ordinary People like us)
      People are those who will vote so isn't it best to speak directly to them?

      Commenter
      yys
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:54PM
    • Sorry Hacka, but it’s true, now we really get to see how the worm turns! Get ready for some Kevin Rudd bottom lip action.

      Commenter
      Peter G
      Location
      Drummoyne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:07PM
    • "I think it's time he demonstrated to the country he had a bit of ticker on this, I mean he's the boxing blue, I'm the glasses-wearing kid in the library, come on, let's have the Australian people form a view about whether his policies actually have substance...or whether they are just slogans."
      That was when he thought he could win. No one seems to mind when Kevin changes his position these days. *lets play the metaphore game
      Kevin has more positions than..... ..
      1.a contortionist speed dating.

      Commenter
      Cwitty
      Location
      Sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:17PM
    • Kevin has more positions than ... Bill Shorten in a leadership challenge.

      Commenter
      Nulla
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:32PM
    • Hacka,

      You're confused again.

      It was Abbott with his false bravado asserting that he would debate Rudd every day once Rudd announced the election date.

      Rudd wanted 5 debates, Abbott only 3.

      And if Abbott is so keen for the public to ask the questions, why has Abbott failed to front up for 1 hr of questions on Q&A. Julia Gillard managed it.

      Rudd turned up to debate Abbott at the National Press Club weeks ago. Abbott failed to make an appearance.

      And as for these constant claims of ABC bias, ABC radio told audiences Abbott and Scott Morrison have turned down several requests for interview.

      Commenter
      Tristan
      Location
      Melbourne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:29PM
  • Get a haircut Rudd!

    Commenter
    Sharron
    Location
    Canberra
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 2:23PM
    • He can't, he's like biblical Samson. His wispy locks give him the strength to lie.

      Commenter
      Nulla
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:09PM
  • Gee the soldiers in Townsville look thrilled to see Kev.

    Commenter
    Kimberley
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 2:23PM
    • No wonder he prefers photo shoots at primary schools with little kids.

      Commenter
      Jo
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:45PM
    • From the soldiers I know know here in Townsville they are not impressed with Rudd and the ALP. It has all to do with the budget cuts to defence that has them really peed off.

      Commenter
      tom
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:49PM
  • Labors costings have not released - this information from federal treasury on Labor's 2013 election costings to date "Costing requests from the Australian Labor Party and releases will be a posted on this page as it becomes available." Well there you go!!

    Commenter
    Baltic13
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 2:18PM
    • When will Rudd Labors hypocrisy stop!

      Commenter
      Fran
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:27PM
    • Also the Green's costings have not been released - the Coalition's costings have not been released - how many times have the PM and his Minister reminded us of this +++++++++ times

      Commenter
      Baltic13
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:38PM
    • 6 years in the Job they have No Costings.
      Scream like banshees at the LNP yet they have no costings. Labor are distracting from their own lack of costings,lack of ability, lack of integrity.. and they are the government FFS. How much will PNG cost and where will you get the money? Labor is too scared to submit costing...
      typical gutless wonders..

      Commenter
      Cwitty
      Location
      Sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:43PM
    • The Greens had their policy costings up first.

      Labor has had ongoing policy costings because their running the government. We know what they've been doing in the past 6 years and we know how much it has all cost.

      The only one we have very little information on is the Coalition.

      It would be helpful if the Liberal Lovers here would actually check their facts before they try to throw mud.

      Commenter
      Tom
      Location
      Canberra
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:01PM
    • Labor's costings are worthless. The past six years have shown they have not been able to balance a budget, why should anyone believe they can get their figures right now.

      Commenter
      Nulla
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:05PM
    • Tom - if you read my first comment I was referring to the Federal Treasury Website - that is where all parties costings are published

      Commenter
      Baltic13
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:16PM
  • Abbott's more popular than Rudd in QLD. Poor Kevie will be a mess!

    Commenter
    JK
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 2:15PM
    • I'm a Queenslander and that doesn't surprise me one bit. All the media hype down south about Rudds popularity up here is rubbish. He maybe popular in his electorate but that's about it.

      Commenter
      Sandy
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:54PM
    • Only if you listen to LNP supporters.

      Commenter
      Grey Nomad
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:13PM
    • No Grey, it was a poll.

      Commenter
      Fred
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:32PM
  • Treasury has spent the last six years helping Labor get into the mess. Disagreeing now would mean admitting they got it wrong too.

    Commenter
    Cat
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 2:00PM
  • PEFO seems to reiterate the "jarring disconnect" that Saul Eslake described last week. The idea that unemployment would drop significantly in 2015-16 even though growth remained flat.

    Did PEFO address this ?

    Commenter
    Hacka
    Location
    Canberra
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 1:59PM
  • It's more conventional that the rusted-on reds scream bias whenever there is an article\opinion critical of the Dear Leader, Kevin Jong Il.

    But. Tim Colebatch wears his bias like a badge of honour.

    Partisan and selective opinion pieces, prickling with fear and loathing.

    Better suited for the tabloids methinks.

    Commenter
    Louis Cypher
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 1:57PM
    • This IS a tabliod. Call it a compact format if you like, but if it walks like a tabliod and talks like a tabloid.... it is a tabloid. Welcome to the Yellow press.

      Commenter
      Cwitty
      Location
      Sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:26PM
    • What are your thoughts on the News Limited coverage??

      Commenter
      Sam
      Location
      Sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:38PM
    • Um, I think it's a website??!!!

      Commenter
      Norm
      Location
      Maroubra
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:45PM
  • We have.......
    "Abbott is going to increase the GST"
    "Abbott will not release costings".
    So far we have heard Abbott say.....
    "the Coalition will NOT increase the GST."
    "costings will be released in good time before the election and after PEFO is released"
    Let's just wait and see whether these statements made by Labor and some journo's is true or just biased garbage, story telling and gossip!

    Commenter
    Jeremy
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 1:54PM
  • Abbott has ruled out a GST increase, will Rudd rule out any increase in the price of carbon above its current rate of $24 per tonne

    Commenter
    Concerned electricity consumer
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 1:34PM
    • Did you forget that voting means; electing your own dictator. Can you tell me what happens to the voters after election?

      Commenter
      Half
      Location
      Sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:06PM
    • Half - its a simple question, I am not interested in wacky political conspiracy theories. Rudd claims he has terminated the carbon tax but the Coalition claim that CO2 prices will rise to $38 per tonne by 2020. Can someone provide a clear answer on this question? Who is telling the truth?

      Commenter
      Concerned electricity consumer
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:19PM
    • @CEC

      PEFO, like the budget, assumes in its modelling that the Carbon price reaches $38 per tonne by 2019-20.

      Commenter
      Puzzled
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:23PM
    • Its called carbon pricing under an ETS. It is the policy that Abbott went to the election with under never, ever Howard in 2007. But he reneged on that in 2009.

      Clearly, the motto of the Liberals is:

      'We will decide what promises we are going to keep and the circumstances in which we will keep them'.

      Commenter
      Whyalla Wipeout
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:33PM
    • Thanks Puzzled, yours was the only coherent answer

      Commenter
      Concerned electricity consumer
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:43PM
    • @CEC

      Glad I could help.

      The strange thing is that if it doesn't get to $38 per tonne then there will be a hole to fill. If it does, then it will impact on lots of costs.

      Neither seem like particularly attractive outcomes.

      Commenter
      Puzzled
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:50PM
  • Costings.

    Heard Nick Minchin talking to Fran Kelly on RN yesterday morning. He pointed out the strategy when in opposition is to release your policies and their costings progressively through the campaign period to maintain momentum/coverage. There is no way he would expect any opposition, Lab or Lib to do otherwise. In the runup to the 2007 election he was finance minister (why do they come from SA?) and his job was to keep hounding Labor to come out with their costings, without expecting that they really would..

    Commenter
    Norm
    Location
    Maroubra
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 1:34PM
  • I've been wondering why our PM is so fond of campaigning in Primary Schools talking to children who are too young to vote. I believe I've found the reason, He wants them to remember him as sometime into the future they have to pay for the huge debt his government is accumulating. How nice of Mr Rudd! What a really decent man he is!

    Commenter
    Billnix
    Location
    Western Sydney
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 1:23PM
    • and some people poke fun of Abbott surrounded by his family!

      Commenter
      Ian
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:41PM
    • Billnix, the reason Rudd will only face 5 year olds is that they don't ask questions.

      Commenter
      thepres
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:59PM
    • Rudd's more gutless than Gillard. At least Gillard could put up a good fight, Rudd is a weakling. He like's photo's of him surrounded by cheering kiddies.
      Gillard versus Abbott would have been a much better debate. Rudd the weakling was a nervous ninny!

      Commenter
      Luke
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:13PM
  • Now that PEFO has come out with its forecast which confirms the government's own estimates, it is time for Abbot to tell the Australians where and how he is going to fill in the $70 billion hole. There is no way to run and no place to hide for him. Come clean Tony. You have taken enough time to do your math. Now it is time to lay it on the table for all to see.

    Commenter
    JISantiago
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 1:20PM
    • Yes, he should start by outlining how he's going to repay the near $400B debt he'll inherit from Gillard, Swan, Rudd, Bowen and Wong.
      The audacity of demanding the Coalition's costings when their own budgets don't last 3 months is amazing.

      Commenter
      Puzzled
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:37PM
    • Puzzled, if you read the briefing it says that the debt will be repaid, and it also shows that the economy will return to surplus.

      Commenter
      Tone
      Location
      Melbourne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:50PM
    • Tone

      It forecasts a return to surplus (just) by 2016-17. Where does it say all the debt will be repaid?

      Commenter
      Puzzled
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:26PM
    • Tone,

      "the budget will be returned to surplus"...

      hahahaha, now where have we heard that one lately! Only this time, Tone, the ALP really mean it!

      Commenter
      beasleyst
      Location
      Sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:31PM
  • Gee Stephanie, Turnbull's the sensible person protecting his eyes, what the h###s wrong with that?! EVERYONE in this country should wear protective eyewear and hats when outdoors even in winter. It saves their eys and saves health care $$$$$$ down the track.

    Commenter
    Norm
    Location
    Maroubra
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 1:04PM
    • Tounge in cheek, doesn't hurt to laugh

      Commenter
      Jitterry
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:19PM
    • A reference to all the media rot when Julia donned glasses, me thinks. We didn't hear the end of it for what seemed an eternity.

      Commenter
      A country gal
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:28PM
    • No, Stephanie "shuddered" at the photochromic lenses. It's nice to try to make this blog entertaining, no problem there, but try to be sensible and not make silly comments on other people's choices that you may not like yourself - he wasn't hiding behind a tint while being interviewed - that's a whole different "trust" thing.

      Commenter
      Norm
      Location
      Maroubra
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:40PM
  • Hey Steph - did you notice that Rupert is after you too by the looks of it ? Today's Daily Terror has a couple of extracts of Sunday night's Pulse, something about a Reith tweet. "They said it" section i think.

    Could be a slow news day over at the DT.

    Commenter
    Hacka
    Location
    Canberra
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 12:58PM
  • Well PolitiFact has stated that they can change the GST without the permission of the states. Abbott is a classic rule breaker, so if they want to increase the GST, they will.

    Commenter
    Tom
    Location
    Canberra
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 12:54PM
    • Dear Desperate,

      1), During the debate on Sunday night, TA categorically ruled out any rise in the GST.
      2), Christopher Pyne also categorically ruled out any increase under the coalition.
      3), Having a review of the entire tax system is way over due. Certainly, I admit governments of all persuasions have been promisong this for a long time without actually doing anything (except for Howard and the GST), however, slamming the potential for such a review is so short sighted as to show that you are not seeking government in the interests of the nation, rather the tribe instead. I say this as Labor simply stands for more taxes and not reform.

      Mind you I am also interested in Rudd's juvenile repetition of TA and the GST line. I do remember some unwanted taxes such as the Carbon tax and the MRRT. The only difference between you and TA was that yours were real they actually existed, your GST demands are simply an unsophisticated and juvenile scare campaign.

      Out of satisfaction, this in The Age's Opinion article:

      "You have to salute the courage of Treasury secretary Martin Parkinson and Finance Department secretary David Tune. Under serious pressure from their next political masters to produce a set of numbers favourable to the Coalition, they have stood their ground."

      Another admission that Labor is gone. There was a "nah, nah, nah, nah, nah" at the end but i'll take that for having made such an admission.

      Commenter
      housemartin
      Location
      Hong Kong
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:13PM
    • There is a pattern of regressive policy from the Liberal Party. This is a regressive policy and they need something to fill their $50 Billion Dollar independently assessed black hole. The GST would be perfect for this. After they get in, the Liberals will still lie and call it a dire emergency, and that it will be necessary to increase the GST. But they will steer clear of the mining tax, a tax that would have benefited us all.

      Commenter
      Tom
      Location
      Melbourne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:54PM
  • Christopher Pyne hinting at a change of leadership to Turnbull!!
    "there will be no change to the GST under an Abbott government."
    They have already said they will include the GST in the subset of taxes they are reviewing. That means they are serious about implementing changes to the GST. Therefore that means they are considering a change in leader.

    Commenter
    Steve
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 12:50PM
    • Is that you Kev? Making up stories again.

      Commenter
      JBF
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:56PM
    • Steve

      Care to tell us what is required to make any change to the current level of GST?

      I suspect you will not answer, as you know it will shoot down your argument.

      Commenter
      $keptic
      Location
      Melbourne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:23PM
    • Are we a democracy" people power"? or are an OLIGARCHY "POWER BY THE FEW" ?

      Commenter
      Half
      Location
      Sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:09PM
  • Remember the scare campaign the Coalition ran on the carbon tax -

    Whyalla Wipeout
    $100 per kg of meat

    Now that the ALP are running a scare campaign on the GST review the prima donnas are getting offended.

    Commenter
    Sam
    Location
    Sydney
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 12:41PM
    • Agree with you that they are/were both scare campaigns.

      Commenter
      Smith
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:58PM
  • Pre-poll voting begins next Tuesday. Not leaving much time to scrutinise Coalition costingsm is it? Such a lack of respect for the voters..

    Commenter
    Susana
    Location
    Lismore
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 12:37PM
    • How can they show costings with a $70B black hole according to Joe Hockey or at least $50 according to others........ G$T, 12-15% here we come and start looking for a job if you're a public servant.

      Commenter
      FrankM
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:53PM
    • 2007 and 2010 the ALP released the costings of their policies at 5 pm on the Friday before the election. No time for any examination of their policies before the people the vote
      So do not do as I do but do as I say according to the ALP.

      Commenter
      terry
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:54PM
    • Typical, I'm going to be OS and about to checkout what to do- to vote before, at the airport or the Consulate on the day.
      My vote is decided, but for some, one major issue being addressed may swing theirs.
      Anyone but Abbott.

      Commenter
      A country gal
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:58PM
    • I wouldn't worry too much Susana. Labor have got their costings (Budget) badly wrong for five years in a row. They only came out with their latest patch up last week. Just a mere $30 Billion dollars out in a ten week time frame. Incompetence at its worst.

      Commenter
      Facts are
      Location
      Brisbane
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:40PM
  • If Gay marriage can swing marginal seats. Why have we not seen David Bradbury holding up Rainbow signs at Penrith Train Station instead of those bright green Gonski signs that are there most mornings? He holds the seat on a slim margin. According to reports Gay marriage could make the difference... So why wont he campaign for the pink vote... I wonder?

    Commenter
    Cwitty
    Location
    Sydney
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 12:37PM
  • Did anyone else see Julie Bishop this morning on some ABC TV footage? She was visiting a seat somewhere, possibly QLD, and I actually heard her utter "dire state of the (Australian?) economy." What a lie...and how irresponsible! What was funny was she then pledged 300K I think for a sporting field. Geez, these promises are really adding up! What a big priority when things are dire! Hmmm.

    Commenter
    Passionfruit
    Location
    Sydney
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 12:34PM
    • I saw that, was in Queensland for hockey it's such a huge sport in Australia according to Bishop, but lets face it the zomby Australian votes will believe her.

      Commenter
      amro
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:27PM
  • Come clean on cuts to fill your $50 black hole and 'never ever' G$T increases.......

    Commenter
    FrankM
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 12:32PM
    • $50... I've got that on me.
      When complaining about other people not getting their numbers right what do you think is important make sure you get right?

      Commenter
      Cwitty
      Location
      Sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:40PM
    • Yes, get it right, it's a $50 Billion Dollar independently assessed Black Hole in the Liberal Party's policy costings.

      Commenter
      Tone
      Location
      Melbourne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:46PM
    • I thought it was $70Billion. It seems labor change eir lie day by day. What about the $300Billion black hole left by labor, who is going to fix that?

      Commenter
      Denny
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:47PM
    • The Labor Party probably still think it's $70 Billion, but PolitiFact independently assessed the humongous Black Hole in the Liberal Party's policy costings at $50 Billion Dollars. Given that PolitiFact are independent scrutineers of claims made, I will accept that there is a $50 Billion Dollar Black Hole in the Liberal Party's costings.

      Commenter
      Tone
      Location
      Melbourne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:50PM
    • "Given that PolitiFact are independent scrutineers of claims made ... "

      Count so far:

      8 questions on Abbott
      2 on Labor.

      Decisions in. Love that independence.

      Commenter
      housemartin
      Location
      Hong KOng
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:29PM
    • So Labor have a 20 billion black hole in their Black Hole costing’s.. If labor can't work out the size of the opposition black hole how do they expect the coalition to work it out, hypocrites. Everyone should focus on getting their own black hole costing’s right before they worry about other peoples…

      Commenter
      Cwitty
      Location
      Sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:39PM
    • Huh, sorry cwitty, I understand your desperation at backing a severely inferior party, but I haven't heard that $20 Billion figure before. Did you just make that up?

      Commenter
      Tone
      Location
      Melbourne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:48PM
    • Oh I get it. You are trying to focus on Labor's figures. Yes, the Liberal Party do have at least a $50 Billion Dollar Black Hole. It might be $70 Billion if Labor have it right. But I understand what you're trying to do. Desperation makes you go silly.

      Commenter
      Tom
      Location
      Melbourne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:56PM
  • Here come the latest set of excuses. Abbott has had 6 months to prepare his costings. He has had weeks since the last revision f Treasury numbers and he is now saying he needs time.
    BULL!

    Commenter
    Steve
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 12:32PM
    • Poor Steve, political naivety at its best.

      Commenter
      housemartin
      Location
      Hong Kong
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:34PM
    • Steve,
      When will the ALP release the costings of their policies?
      Will they do what they did in 2010 and 2007 when they released them on the Friday before the election.

      Commenter
      terry
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:55PM
  • Stephanie

    As "a fan of political debates" I suggest the debate last Sunday was not a debate, but an exercise in electorate gullibility. Can you point to one question that was relevant to Labor's or the Coalition's faux climate change policies?

    The press are not stupid yet they allow Rudd and Abbott to con the Australian people with lies and deceit. Exactly what is the use of wind turbines that are only 32% efficient yet claimed 100% efficient to reach an inadequate emissions target? One would think that such a deception to be newsworthy?

    Can Abbott's climate change policy work? No it is farcicle.

    Commenter
    Pen of hrba
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 12:17PM
  • Mr Abbott: "I want to be known as someone who underpromises and overdelivers."

    Underpromises swingeing cuts - overdelivers in spades.

    Just like Campbell Newman.

    Commenter
    Whyalla Wipeout
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 12:07PM
    • well thats better than over promising and under delivering as did/does Rudd and Gillard

      Commenter
      M&M's
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:22PM
    • "We have returned to surplus - rolled, gold, guaranteed".

      Must be the second biggest over promise and under delivery of this term of parliament.

      Commenter
      Hacka
      Location
      Canberra
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:30PM
    • Yes, But Abbott is still hiding the savage cuts he is going to make. In 2010 he was caught out with an $11 billion black hole.

      This time he is not even going to pretend to tell the truth to the Australian public.

      Commenter
      Whyalla Wipeout
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:35PM
  • Didn't a Sky News bloke host the 1st debate? That was iffy enough given Murdoch's declared bias in this election. For Abbott to insist on a 2nd debate actually on Sky, on pay TV which the majority of Australians can't watch, is a bit rich.

    Not sure I like K-Rudd's channel 7 social media gimmick idea either, though.

    They should rip off the Americans and use the same style of 2nd and 3rd debates that Obama and Romney did. Thought those were good.

    Commenter
    Arky
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 12:00PM
    • The debate rated so low that it will be relegated to a second channel 7two or Mate. It's all well and good for Kev to want it on commercial station but he forgets that commercial station needs to make money.. If nobody wants to watch how will commercial station sell advertising? The debate will be up against X-factor and AGT, 7 will get slaughtered in the ratings. Can’t show it on the ABC as they are too biased. Maybe it is a good idea to show it on Sky, the political tragics that want to watch the debate already have foxtel, (there is no other way to be outraged over foxnews)… The rest of us can watch talent shows..

      Commenter
      Cwitty
      Location
      debates r boring
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:28PM
    • 1. I'm pretty sure Rudd didn't propose Channel 7 without asking Channel 7 first.

      2. The constant bleating about ABC bias from Coalition supporters is a furphy. There have been multiple reviews into this. Howard stacked the board of the ABC with Coalition political partisans. But apparently if you're not horribly biased towards the Coalition you're biased against them.

      Commenter
      Arky
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:21PM
    • Have it on Sky Nobody will complain that they 'missed out' on the debate. Even if they don't have foxtel they wont miss a thing.

      Commenter
      Cwitty
      Location
      Sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:47PM
    • Every network - including 7 - would have access to Sky's broadcast. Just like on Sunday. The best debates are the one's where the journo's get out of the way and let the candidates do the talking.

      Commenter
      brian
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:00PM
  • There's no doubt that the GST is a big bogey monster to a lot of people. More's the pity. Of course rational thought rarely has anything to do with politics. Even Rhyss Muldoon admitted that an increase in the GST was probably not a stupid idea...

    The reality is that if the Australian people want more social justice spending, a la Disability Care etc, the money needs to come from ALL of us and a broad based GST is the best way to achieve that, with the minimum amount of pain to all.

    The coalition's plan to review ALL taxes is sound and they are on record that if a GST change is recommended, they would not implement it without going to a vote from the people. Simple as that.

    Any other scare mongering (or should we call that "relentless negativity) by the ALP is just hot air, trying to divert attention from the real issue, which is the crap state that the economy is now in, as a result of 6 years of Labor rule.

    Commenter
    Alternate View
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 11:57AM
    • "The coalition's plan to review ALL taxes is sound"

      But they are not reviewing ALL taxes, AV. They are not reviewing the mining super profits tax, for example.

      The only taxes that they are 'reviewing' are the ones they want to change. And you can bet your bottom dollar that that they will pick the people to conduct the 'review' who will give them the answer they want.

      Like Campbell Newman in Queensland.

      Commenter
      Whyalla Wipeout
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:13PM
    • If you are a self-funded retiree then an increase in the GST has no offsets and you are in trouble.

      Alright for you if you are in well paid employment you can see the GST being offset against income tax.

      Commenter
      Norm
      Location
      Maroubra
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:21PM
    • Food at 10-15% more I don't need! Okay if you're rich I guess.....

      Commenter
      FrankM
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:54PM
  • On the "sunday nights offering" for a dabate.
    Maybe if Rudd didn't just stand there staring at his notes with a quivering bottom lip and actually looked at Abbott and spoke it might have appeared a little more exciting.

    Commenter
    Lance
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 11:57AM
    • Maybe if Abbott didn't just come out with the same old boring slogans and lies it would have been more exciting. But pigs would fly past the stage first. And that would be almost as exciting (and unlikely) as Abbott being honest.

      Commenter
      Whyalla Wipeout
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:09PM
    • Kevie reminds of one of those people who run around behind your back making up stories and gossiping and when they are confronted by the person they shake in their shoes with fear. Just like he did on Sunday night with Abbott.

      Commenter
      Al
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:23PM
    • WW - iy must make you proud that labor replaced a liar with a cheat. If rudd cannot read the instructions properly how in go name can he run the country?

      Commenter
      Denny
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:30PM
    • Lance
      If Abbott had some notes, do you think he might have been able to answer one of the questions?

      Commenter
      Steve
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:34PM
    • Whyalla..Kevin Rudd answered every question with blah, blah, "NBN ,blah blah, said " putting all our eggs in one basket" at least 5 times,"frankly" about 30 times. "folks, good folks and good folks of Australia", "lets be real here" more times than I can bear to count etc etc. His hand movements were fascinating to begin with but quickly became farcial... Kevin Rudd is the ultimate bore.

      Commenter
      thereisnoyouinLabor
      Location
      Brisbane
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:48PM
    • there is no u, I'm afraid that, after reading your incoherent post, nobody could top you for the honour of 'ultimate bore'.

      Commenter
      Whyalla Wipeout
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:36PM
    • denny, re your comment about liars and cheats, it must be good to have Tony Abbott who exemplifies these qualities in the one person. Typical liberal efficiency - all the nasties in one simple package - and nastier too.

      Commenter
      Whyalla Wipeout
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:52PM
  • The Liberal Party claim that they won't bring back WorkChoices or increase GST, but the public have to be suspicious given their ongoing behaviour, such as including the GST for review when they claim they have no intention of introducing it.

    The Liberals have an existing pattern of introducing regressive policy - policy that is detrimental to the general population and benefits the rich. They introduced the GST in the first place, which has turned out to be the biggest tax in Australian history, which benefits the rich at the expense of the middle class and poor.

    Labor do not have that pattern. When Labor do something, the general population are generally the beneficiaries, not the rich, which is essentially why the Liberals always try to trash Labor policy.

    So the question is, who do you trust, the Liberal Party, a party who has a tradition of introducing regressive policy? I don't think so.

    Commenter
    Tone
    Location
    Melbourne
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 11:47AM
    • What a joke. Who can possibly trust the ALP, given their recent 6 years of broken promises and extreme budget blowouts?

      A couple of highlights to remember:

      There will be no carbon tax under a Government I lead"

      "The budget will be in surplus in 2012/2013"

      Commenter
      Alternate View
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:03PM
    • Benn listening to Chrissy this morning I see LOL

      Commenter
      Adam
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:12PM
    • There will be no carbon tax under a government I lead, but I am determined to introduce an ETS with a carbon price.

      And that is exactly what we have!

      Commenter
      Whyalla Wipeout
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:15PM
    • Nothing you've said there makes an ounce of difference to me. I can certainly trust the Labor Party more than the Liberal Party. The Liberal Party have a pattern of regressive policies that make the average person pay more and the rich get to reduce their share of tax at the same time. Labor haven't done that.

      The carbon tax was good policy - it was a pollution tax that caused the 500 largest polluters to pay tax on their pollution. To be able to compete, they are forced to reduce their pollution. Less pollution in our environment is a good thing.

      Commenter
      Tone
      Location
      Melbourne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:20PM
    • Pal nobody trusts labor. Gillard was proved a liar again and again and rudd has proved himself a cheat and a liar.

      Commenter
      Denny
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:24PM
    • At least the LNP had the guts to take the GST to an election. ot unlike Labor who promised no carbon tax under a government I lead and then introduced one.

      The eleciton comes down to more than trust. It comes down to who do you believe. Labor and Krudd have consistently demonstrated they will promise one thing in campaign mode and do the complete opposite in government mode.

      So, can you believe the man who in 2007 said he would turn back the boats and nw says it can't be done, stop political advertisements that were a cancer on the system but now floods us with advertisements, wanted to reduce cost of living pressures so promised us Fuel Watch and Grocery Watch (still waiting)and at the same time supports a tax that will rise to almost $40 a tonne which will be passed on to consumers, with respect to health care take over if it wasn't fixed (the buck stops with me) and didn't do a thing (still waiting for my Super Clinic Kev), said Climate Change was the great moral challenge of our time and did nothing, said he would consult more with business the second time around and then introduced a change to the FBT that will kill off the car manufacturing industry in Australia and associated businesses, took notes to the mass debate when the rules said no notes and said under no circumstances would he return to the leadership of the Labor Party and then lo and behold challenged Gillard for the PM spot.

      A New Way? Seems like de ja vu to me.

      Commenter
      Smokin Mo
      Location
      Ryde
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:26PM
    • WW - you should go back and check thapes because that is NOT what gillard said. It is what you lefties like to think she said but sadly for you she lied. She lied about it then and has never stopped. The simple-minded have have been completely fooled.

      Commenter
      Denny
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:45PM
    • Tone, I have a couple of questions for you as you seem to know everything.
      Where did you read that the Libs will bring in WorkChoices and increase the GST.
      When you come out with things like this it is a sure sign that Labor is desperate.
      Did you watch Penny Wong's face on Q&A and her quivering lip, totally out of her depth.

      Commenter
      thepres
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:14PM
    • No, thepres, I am simply stating that the Liberals have a pattern of introducing these regressive policies. They've done it before, whereas Labor hasn't. When in government, they can do whatever they want, and they know it. If they want to increase GST and bring back WorkChoices under another name, against public wishes, they can. You know they want to.

      Commenter
      Tone
      Location
      Melbourne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:25PM
    • What did she say, Denny.

      All you Lieberals ever do is deny without evidence. And then have the hide to tell the rest of us to find the evidence to support the lies.

      Just like Abbott and Hockey will never add up their lies (oops, non-core promises) but tell us to trawl through the slogan cesspit on their site to work it out.

      Commenter
      Whyalla Wipeout
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:39PM
  • Really wish people would do some research and apply some perspective before leaving partisan comments. This article is based on facts, not political spin.
    http://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/1799702/Comment-How-strong-is-Australias-economy

    Commenter
    Chippsy
    Location
    Sydney
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 11:39AM
    • You can't let facts get in the way of partisan rants.

      Commenter
      Tone
      Location
      Melbourne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:42AM
    • Chippsy - no point trying to scare to Coalition supporters with the truth. They don't like it!

      Commenter
      Pete
      Location
      Deception Bay
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:48AM
    • Great article.

      There is no doubt we are in a better position than much of the world, we just need to be careful to ensure the situation stays that way.

      Excessive spending or cuts will both have a deleterious effect.

      Commenter
      Sick of this
      Location
      Adelaide
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:57AM
    • I think we need a referendum to change the constitution so that from now on all politicians leading their respective political parties need to be connected to a lie detector whilst given a media conference or participating in a debate. We can call it the "BS Clause"

      Commenter
      Chippsy
      Location
      Sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:01PM
    • Chpsy - the article only focuses on federal debt. What is the result when you add in the debt labor left in Qld, NSW and Victoria? That would be the honest approach but as we have seen from Rudd, honesty is not a quality respected in labor.

      Commenter
      Denny
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:51PM
    • @ Denny - thought we were talking about a federal election? I simply presented an article that dealt with facts (I know surprising in this campaign) and you've tried to turn it into a bi-partisan honesty argument - which we could easily do for both sides of politics as you will see by the countless comments down the side of this page. The fact of the matter is Australia's economy is a lot stronger than it is too often negatively portrayed - not whether Abbott or Rudd has lied.

      Commenter
      Chippsy
      Location
      Sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:04PM
    • @chippy
      I think we need a referendum to change the constitution so that from now on all politicians leading.....

      That's exactly one of the main policies of Pauline Hanson One nation you should check the "Citizens Initiated Referendum". I don't understand why the media is keeping us in the dark about that.

      Commenter
      Half
      Location
      Sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:04PM
  • Wheres the money for the NBN hidden? straight away there is saving, plus all the green bureaucracy that failed to deliver any jobs. I say raise the GST its the only fair way to pay for incompetence rather than levies on jobs, insurance, FBT, petrol, tobacco (i am non smoker). providing its not the same as the last 6 years of failure. Labor couldn't even forecast correctly the winners of a horse race that the results were known....Penny Wong the $106 B errors over her time in the job as finance minister.(called cooking the books)

    Commenter
    Damian
    Location
    NSW
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 11:37AM
  • Labor has ruled out decreasing the GST. Penny Wong has refused on numerous occasions to reduce the GST. Reducing the GST is not up for review and for Labor cutting the GST is completely off the table. Labor knows that it hurts low income earners but have flatly refused to reduce the TAX or to narrow the base. Labor need to explain why they refuse any review or any attempt to reduce the cost of living pressures by reducing the rate of GST. They won’t even consider it! Shame!

    Commenter
    Cwitty
    Location
    Sydney
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 11:31AM
    • I vote for Kevin on two things. Gay marriage and stopping boats. Then next election will be Julian Assane party.

      Commenter
      Meh1
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:38AM
    • Quick look over there!!!!

      Commenter
      tasch2
      Location
      Mornington Peninsula
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:55AM
  • Albo says we can all now get 1GB speeds to homes under the NBN.

    Can anyone let me know what the monthly plan cost would be for that?

    Anyone? Albo couldn't....

    Commenter
    beasleyst
    Location
    Sydney
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 11:31AM
    • 20k per month according to Turnbull and given his experience in the industry I'm inclined to believe him.

      Commenter
      Sick of this
      Location
      Adelaided
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:40AM
    • LOL Albo wouldn't have a clue.

      Commenter
      Jack
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:46AM
    • Albo said we can all have it at 1GB. He was so proud. He even has a flyer saying the ALP is delivering the NBN to your house for free!
      Albo rocks!

      Commenter
      beasleyst
      Location
      Sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:52AM
    • http://www.gizmodo.com.au/2013/04/nbn-co-to-offer-1-gigabit-broadband-speeds-by-december/

      Wholesale price to an ISP for 1 Gigabit
      $150 per month

      Commenter
      Charles Foster Kane
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:58AM
    • 20k is a deceptive figure. He's based it on current pricing, and when the NBN switches on 1Gb speeds the costs will plummet. Understand that 100Mbps can be received for about $50 per month. That's considerably less than what Telstra charges for it's fast broadband service, about half in fact, essentially because Telstra had no competition, and will have no real competition until the NBN is rolled out.

      Telstra love the thought of the NBN being limited at 24Mbps, which is the maximum speed of the Liberal plan, because they'll still be able to charge rip-off prices for their 100Mbps cable.

      The Liberal plan is far far inferior, especially given that we'll still be stuck with expensive, noisy, seriously degrading copper wires to the home.

      Commenter
      Tone
      Location
      Melbourne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:59AM
    • Tone, the whole NBN business plan is based on the costs per user increasing steadily, not plummeting, as Malcolm Turnbull also pointed out.

      There's a disconnect here. Can you see it?

      Commenter
      Alternate View
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:05PM
    • How dare he base his price on current actual pricing when he can just pull a random figure out of the air and use that?

      Commenter
      Sick of this
      Location
      Adelaide
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:06PM
    • The price increases that Malcolm was talking about were the prices of the existing NBN 100Mbps connection.

      Yes, the NBN document says the price will increase, but if the NBN as a whole only needs to make a 7% return, then getting the higher speeds without having to pay more is certainly possible.

      It's turned out that the technological end points don't cost much more for 1Gbps, so they are just going to do it.

      Commenter
      Tone
      Location
      Melbourne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:14PM
    • Alternate
      The costs per user are growing exponentially at the moment.
      NBN business case predicts a relatively low increase in cost per user but a huge increase in the amount of data used per user.
      Currently, Australia is doubling its downloads every few years and that is accelerating. Where do you think the average will be in 20 years time?

      Commenter
      Steve
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:40PM
    • Tone,

      Who is providing NBN 100Mbs for $50 per month?

      Can you back up your statement?

      Commenter
      beasleyst
      Location
      Sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:58PM
    • beasleyst

      With the LNPs version of the NBN will we have plastic bags with that?
      Hows the CBA going? have they (LNP)factored in all costs or just some?

      Maybe they will reincarnate ,Samuel Morse, Joseph Henry, and Alfred Vail to show TA how the morse code works?

      Commenter
      Buffalo Bill
      Location
      Sydneys Northshore
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:06PM
    • Oh yea, whoops, I read the figure wrong - it's $70 per month for 100Mbps from iiNet. But hey, it's still much cheaper than Telstra and there would be no competition to Telstra without it.

      Commenter
      Tone
      Location
      Melbourne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:09PM
  • To those whinging re: THE DEBT, you don't whinge if your buy a house and have to have a mortgage, aka debt, on it, do you? Or do you expect it for free? The same way, we have a debt (which is relatively low by a country's standard) and services to show for it: education, healthcare, etc.
    The way the economy has been manged means our country can look after us with services the rest of the world only dreams of having. That's why everyone wants to come here, even if by leaky boats.

    Commenter
    Mali
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 11:29AM
    • I guess the difference is, with my mortgage, I don't keep going back to the bank to borrow more to buy my groceries, clothes, schooling etc. At some point it will have to be paid back.

      This is something the ALP have never had to deal with....

      Commenter
      beasleyst
      Location
      Sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:33AM
    • Mali - your assertion is somewhat incorrect. When I buy a house and get a mortgage, it is me who is liable for the debt. I do not ask Job Citizen from across the road to pay for my mortgage! Nor do you leave your mortgage for your kids to repay.

      Commenter
      Pawel
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:33AM
    • When you get a mortgage, you might need to refinance the mortgage to buy a car or an investment property not clothes or food as you suggest. If our debt is one of the best in the world, we have the world's 12th largest economy. We are definitely not buying 'food' with our mortgages. As for that we don't ask others to buy our homes - keep up with the metaphor mate, in a country my taxes go to you and your family as well, not just to me and mine. We are all in this together.

      Commenter
      Mali
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:21PM
    • Debt is good if you are going to build something that lasts a long time and produces a benefit (like you house to you). So Sydney Harbour Bridge, railways, now I guess the NBN. But debt is bad if it is funding recurrent expenses like DisabilityCare, health, eduction, etc - they have to be fully funded year in year out.

      Commenter
      Norm
      Location
      Maroubra
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:30PM
    • You can't compare what Labor is doing is similar to a loan (what you call mortgage). More an overdraft.. and they just keep increasing the limit.

      Also loan's have monthly repayments of principle and interest. Whereas we are currently paying interest only, which is coming out of and increasing overdraft limit.

      Commenter
      the_donge
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:31PM
    • Norm

      Where do you think the money to fund health care, disability care and education ought to come from? Do you really think these are not worthwhile investments in our society??
      Thank you for making my point.

      Commenter
      Mali
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:03PM
  • Thankyou and goodbye Tony Windsor. One of the best, a true gentleman and diligent MP. And most pleasing to hear he is assisting indi Cathy McGowan in INDI. A very real chance of upseating our delightful Sophie.
    I've met and listened to Cathy speak, one very passionate voice of rural Australia. A female version of Tony in many ways.
    Go Cathy, Mirabella we can do without.

    Commenter
    A country gal
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 11:26AM
    • I couldn't agree more with your sentiments about Tony Windsor. He will be greatly missed. I wonder what the people of his electorate will think when Barnaby turns up to claim credit for all that Tony Windsor did for them.

      Commenter
      Whyalla Wipeout
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:43AM
    • not by his electorate ergo that's why he is not running in this election!!!! and why he cant walk down the street in Tamworth without being abused!

      Commenter
      impy
      Location
      tamworth
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:10PM
    • impy, out of interest, were you a supporter of Tony Windsor in the first place or one of the rump country party lot. I suspect the latter. And I suspect you were the one doing the abuse.

      In my experience, the people who get most abused in politics are those who least deserve it.

      Commenter
      Whyalla Wipeout
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:17PM
    • impy
      The polls show Windsor would have romped in.
      Farewell to one of the few honest politicians. we will miss him.

      Commenter
      Steve
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:33PM
    • Impy, well poor fools for believing all the demonising of Tony Windsor.
      History will record him in a very positive light. Any decision he made was well considered and for the common good.
      Good luck with Gina's lacky Barnaby.
      His decision to retire must have been a rapid one though, I had been in contact with him a week before and there was absolutely no indication.
      Sure wish I had such representation.

      Commenter
      A country gal
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:40PM
  • How fascinating that there is a large fall in unemployment (6.25 to 5.0), supported by only modest GDP growth in 2015-16.

    If that large unemployment drop doesn't eventuate, the projected budget surplus for 2016-17 won't happen. Seems rubbery.

    Commenter
    Hacka
    Location
    Canberra
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 11:17AM
    • The reality is Labor has not created sufficient new jobs a month for quite some time. In fact employment statistics are looking decidedly sick. ABS stats for June show the number of new jobs fell to 10,300. The Morgan Poll for June 2013 "claims an estimated 1.2 million Australians (9.7% of the workforce) were unemployed. This is up 35,000 (0.2%) from May. The Australian workforce* was 12,453,000 (up 125,000) comprising 7,540,000 full-time workers (down 57,000).

      Even government revised unemployment of 6.25% underestimates the true situation in line with Morgan. Irrespective of the number unemployment is predicted to skyrocket over the following two years and beyond, in particular as government revenues fall by an estimated $33 billion over the next four years. Employment will also be affected by the slump in commodity prices, which are anticipated to a fall next year with a decline of 5.75%. Expected annual economic growth has also been marked down to 2.5% from 2.75%.

      Commenter
      Pen of hrba
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:34AM
    • No more rubbery than anything Liberals produce. Independently assessed $50 Billion black hole anyone?

      Commenter
      Suppository
      Location
      Canberra
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:02PM
    • its not a black hole if they do the same as the ALP and fund their policies and promises via more borrowings

      Commenter
      M&M's
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:55PM
    • Oh, so what you're saying is if the Liberals change the definition of a Black Hole in their policy costings, it doesn't need to be called a Black Hole any more?

      It sounds like their policy to Stop The Boats. They know it can't be achieved, so they are going to introduce a bill to Stop The Boat Reporting.

      If they stop the boat reporting, they can say whatever they like about how many boats are arriving, because no one will know if they are telling the truth or not.

      Yet more deceptive behaviour from the Liberals.

      Commenter
      Tone
      Location
      Melbourne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:02PM
  • "We'll do a lot, lot better than that," Mr Abbott promises.

    4.45pm - from the party that claims fiscal rectitude.

    Commenter
    Whyalla Wipeout
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 11:16AM
    • It sure does look like Labor is heading for a wipe out, todays betting has Labor $5.50 and the Coalition at $1.15 one punter putting $80,000 on the Coalition. Shocking me right out of my brain.

      Commenter
      Peter G
      Location
      Drummoyne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:29AM
    • So it appears that Whyalla hasn't been wiped out (yet) by the Carbon Tax, but it's neighbour, Pt Pirie is close to extinction from recent reports about the viability of the smelter.

      Commenter
      Alternate View
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:34AM
    • Just goes to show that the smart money knows how stupid and gullible the voting public is.

      All the best betters don't bet on the the likelihood and against the bookie, but on the stupidity of the crowd.

      Commenter
      Whyalla Wipeout
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:45AM
  • It never fails to amaze me how the writers of posts accuse both Labor and the Coalition of lying. It is a foregone conclusion that they are liars. So why on earth are you going to vote for one or the other?

    The definition of a liar is fraud, hypocrite, swindler, pretender, imposter, phony, fake, fraudster and deceiver, and this trust our nation too?

    Commenter
    Pen of hrba
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 11:16AM
  • Stephanie, I don't think Tony Windsor is the "retired MP" until after the writs are returned for his seat after 7th September?

    Commenter
    Norm
    Location
    Maroubra
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 11:01AM
  • Labor wasted the $20bn surplus inherited from Howard. The current deficit is another $30bn. Total Labor waste = $50bn. They are campaigning for a New Way.... Yes a new way to waste anothe $50bn.

    Commenter
    JJ
    Location
    Sydney
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 10:52AM
    • jj, you could well still have a job or business because Labor 'wasted' that money.

      The GFC created the greatest global financial uncertainty in my lifetime. The Government was proactive in ensuring that this country did not get dragged into the maelstrom in the confusion created by the collapse of financial institutions.

      Anyone who calls the money spent in avoiding the great recession in this country a 'waste' is either a discredited supply side economist or a Liberal politician or a dupe of one or the other.

      Commenter
      Whyalla Wipeout
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:07AM
    • Right on JJ, it’s one thing to make an innocent mistake with a word, but it’s a mistake of an entirely different magnitude to have a $30 billion dollar deficit in 3 months, and the interesting thing is, they don’t add the cost of the NBN into these figures, what would the budget deficit blowout be if they were included, no wonder Anthony Albanese does not want to release the NBN report, this Labor government cannot be trusted with the economy. Lest see the report before the election Albo!

      Commenter
      Peter G
      Location
      Drummoyne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:20AM
    • Peter G, have you noticed that the Liberals are not adding the cost of Fraudband into their calculations. That's because the accounting treatment is necessarily different. Still, if your only job is to spruik the lies of the Coalition, you don't need to think. do you?

      Commenter
      Whyalla Wipeout
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:47AM
    • The GFC drastically dropped tax revenues. That would have happened to either party (indeed, it was already starting to happen even before Rudd was elected in 07). Obviously the Coalition aren't keen to highlight this. Nor are they keen to highlight that left to them there would have been little or no stimulus and the economy would have dropped into the same kind of hole as the UK suffered. Nonetheless, you won't find the Coalition saying they would have had surpluses either- they're just happy to let people like you believe that.

      Commenter
      Arky
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:45PM
  • "The Coalition has consistently denied, in the strongest terms, that it has any plan to do so."

    Sorry Stephanie, but 'no plans' and 'no intention' are not the 'strongest terms', as you would have it.

    Mr Abbott's mentor and hero said 'never, ever' - which are the strongest terms - and less than three years later there were comprehensive plans. Tony Abbott, who famously invited the public not to believe anything he said unless it was written down, is hardly to be believed when he says weasel words like 'no plans'.

    As for Pyne, everyone who believes what he has to say also owns a collection of the world's greatest bridges.

    You journalist types are pussycat soft when it comes to calling out Abbott's dishonesty. It's really sad.

    Commenter
    Whyalla Wipeout
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 10:46AM
    • I hope you were similarly scathing of the Labor Party when they introduced the mining tax, the carbon tax, changes to private health insurance, changes to superannuation despite promising they would not touch it 'not one jot, not one tiddle'.

      Commenter
      Nulla
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:07AM
    • Can you quote where the 'not one jot, not one tiddle' came from Nulla? I've never seen that. I suspect it came from the febrile tin foil hat protected mind of some nobody of a coalition supporter.

      But I do wonder why the champions of the Coalition always say they are doing disreputable things because that is what labor did.

      Commenter
      Whyalla Wipeout
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:53AM
    • Whyalla Wipeout, if we had Death Duties can you imagine how much we could raise when Labor dies at the Election, it would just about wipe out Rudd's and Labor's deficit.
      With The Greens also about to die we should have a bit more in the kitty.
      Watch as the car Unions crumble in SA today.

      Commenter
      thepres
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:35PM
  • The coalition clearly said that should they wish to change the GST (subject to the review) they would seek a mandate at a future election. Surely if there is going to be a tax review it should review everything! Labor is clutching at straws on this one; and they are doing the nation a disservice by not having the GST a part of the review for populist reasons.

    Commenter
    tgcheyho
    Location
    Port Macquarie
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 10:45AM
    • tgcheyko
      The coalition have made plenty of contradictory statements about the GST.
      Which one do you choose to believe?
      After the election, they could choose any one of them and claim it was their policy.

      Commenter
      Steve
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:46PM
  • So why isn't anyone reporting today on the fact that Rudd was accused of cheating in the first national debate for the election, when in fact no one had advised him of the 'no notes' prior to the debate. Seems like a set-up to me.

    I can only conclude that Fairfax AND News Ltd want Abbott in - Fairfax is just being more subtle about it in an attempt to retain some of its readers who still appreciate objectivity in the media.

    Commenter
    tim bob
    Location
    'bra
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 10:45AM
  • so what are the interesting people talking about today?

    Commenter
    tim
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 10:43AM
    • Ms Banister One Nation candidate, showed a distinct lack of knowledge and has decided to withdraw following the fallout from her interview with the Seven Network.

      In other news, Opposition Leader Tony Abbott's gaffe from yesterday - in which he mistakenly used the phrase "suppository of all knowledge" - has gone global, with newspapers in the UK and the ABC and CNN networks in the USA all giving it a run.

      Silence is GOLD.

      Commenter
      $silence
      Location
      Sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:51AM
  • There is a cost associated with reviewing the Good & Services Tax (GST).

    Why waste the money when you don't intend to act on the recommendations of the review??

    Commenter
    Sam
    Location
    Sydney
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 10:28AM
    • I think Labor may have confused you - the report is looking into all forms of taxation in Australia, and since the GST forms a big part of Australia's taxation infrastructure it needs to be included in the overall review. It is not a review into the GST only.

      Commenter
      Tim of Altona
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:41AM
    • The coalition clearly said that should they wish to change the GST (subject to the review) they would seek a mandate at a future election. Surely if there is going to be a tax review it should review everything! Labor is clutching at straws on this one; and they are doing the nation a disservice by not having the GST a part of the review for populist reasons.

      Commenter
      tgcheyho
      Location
      Port Macquarie
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:43AM
    • Because they should review all tax's, GST is a tax. They have said if there were to be any changes it would be taken to a follwing election and the voters would vote on it.
      The facts are at some stage someone is going to have to increase taxes to pay for what we all want. Only an irresponsible Govt would not include GST in a review.

      Commenter
      Angus
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:43AM
    • Economists have been stating for a long time, that a comprehensive analysis of the taxation system is required. Labor wimped on the Henry review, by refusing to include the GST as part of it's inquiry. What a farce. The Opposition has consistently said that there will be no change to any GST during the first term, and that any proposal for change will be put to the election. Rudd seems to be the only person who doesn't understand this.

      Commenter
      Facts are
      Location
      Brisbane
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:53AM
    • As soon as LNP gets in power, Hockeynomics will proclaim that the economy is in the pooh (and it's all labor's fault), therefore giving them the excuse to ignore all election promises and instead impose draconian austerity measuers which will further stagnate the economy. The end result will be a contraction of the economy which will destroy small business while leaving only the big industry players left to reap the rewards of their reduced competition. This is what right-wing governments do nowadays - See Europe for examples...

      Commenter
      tim bob
      Location
      'bra
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:10AM
    • Tim, is the review also going to look into death duties?

      Why isn't that on the table. It's a legitimate tax on excessive accrued wealth that applies in most advanced countries.

      Will the review look at a revised mining super-profits tax?

      The fact is that the only taxes on the table are the ones the Opposition is interested in playing with.

      Commenter
      Whyalla Wipeout
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:14AM
    • Tim of Altona, tgcheyho, Angus & Facts Are,

      This is what Pyne said on Q&A yesterday....

      ''There will be no change to the GST in an Abbott government.''

      That does not mean we will ask the electorates mandate...it simply says never.

      So why review it and waste money if you are not gonna change it??

      Commenter
      Sam
      Location
      Sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:19AM
    • "It's a legitimate tax on excessive accrued wealth" applying a tax as a result of the death of a family member is an insult. Even the Green's have backed away from this

      Commenter
      Old thinking
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:22AM
    • Sam
      I didn't see Pyne on Q&A, but I've heard Abbott state on three occasions, that any proposed change to the GST, will be put to an election first.

      Commenter
      Facts are
      Location
      Brisbane
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:26AM
    • Old thinking, I'm not particularly in favour of death duties, but it a legitimate tax, just like GST, income tax and excise duties.

      The simple point is that if you are reviewing all taxation options, these should be in the mix. If you are looking at GST, but these other taxes, it is clear that the 'review' is nothing more than a typical coalition trick to get its plan to change the GST on the agenda.

      Commenter
      Whyalla Wipeout
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:57AM
  • An $100 million policy to address mobile phone blackspots?

    Be interesting to see if this is just a massive free kick to the telcos to fund them to build towers while claiming it's a $100 million investment in rural areas.

    Commenter
    Arky
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 10:28AM
    • Exactly, building the mobile network is a job for the Private Sector Telco's, so Abbott of course wants to throw money at it.

      Building the next generation fixed network is a job for a nation building Public Sector and Abbott doesn't want to do it and if he has to he'll do it only do it on the cheap.

      So what is the priority openly displayed here ?

      Commenter
      havasay
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:46AM
  • All this talk of suppositories and Abbotts black hole..enough!....I*m going fishing

    Commenter
    David D
    Location
    Ettalong Beach
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 10:17AM
  • 9.43 post. The irony for Abbott, welcome to the real world where there are still communications black spots.
    And he's supposedly releasing a policy but can't get the message heard.
    I trust there's plenty of public conveniences available for when the suppository takes effect. Feels like we've had three years of that, giving us all the .........

    Commenter
    A country gal
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 10:12AM
  • The PM is setting today as the deadline for the Coalition to release its election costings - the PEFO costings don't come out until 10am today - ask the PM when we can expect to see the NBN report as accordingly to the Deputy PM it won't be made available prior to the election - smell a rat?

    Commenter
    Baltic13
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 10:02AM
    • Probably cause its billions over budget.

      Commenter
      Sarah of Carnegie
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:06AM
    • Shame Labor don't do as they say. Releasing policies and costings at 5pm on the Friday before an election.

      Commenter
      Jan
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:12AM
    • Why does NBN Co have to release a report prior to the election? Stop the smoke and mirrors. The Limited News Party has to release their costings because anyone with a calculator so far can see that cutting all the revenue, maintaining most of the spending and cutting taxes just doesn't add up. but then maybe it was smallprint at the bottom of their glossy brochure. Who cares what Rudd did in '07. Hockey, Abbott and Pyne have all said they will release figures after the election was called and in good time. They just keep moving the goal posts. I'm worried abot now not '07 but you can continue living in the past, which you may well do with fraudband.

      Commenter
      Future Looking
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:20AM
    • "Probably cause its billions over budget." You mean just like Labor's

      Commenter
      Sick of this
      Location
      Adelaide
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:24AM
    • Labor has a black hole every 10 weeks LOL What do you have tosay about that?
      And there the people with the figures.

      Commenter
      Kippo
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:33AM
    • Rudd is talking big, but he is backing away from the peoples forum debate next week at Broncos in Brisbane. Abbott has already accepted. Strange behaviour coming from Rudd, who has been badgering Abbott for debates, anytime, anywhere.Could be choking.

      Commenter
      Facts are
      Location
      Brisbane
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:05AM
    • @Future Looking - the NBN is Australia's largest and most expensive infrastructure project ever embarked upon.
      Bllions of dollars of taxpayers money being spent.
      It seems only Labor supporters are keen to keep any scrutiny on it's progress and cost blow outs under wraps until after the election.

      Commenter
      Tim of Altona
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:20AM
    • Paul Keating had a $10 billion "black hole" that he managed to hide before John Howard was elected.

      The cost and viability of the NBN is the current Labor government's black hole that the incoming Coalition government will inherit. There is no doubt that the business plan is deeply flawed and ultimately will reveal that the project is in no way whatsoever viable as a business investment, the basis on which Labor is keeping the cost off the budget bottom line.

      When the coalition government is elected, as appears to be very likely, there will no doubt be a review of the forecast cost and income and it is extremely likely that it just wont make money. When that happens, the whole cost will be shifted (by law) into the budget, thereby creating at least a $34billion (and probably larger) "black hole" left behind by the outgoing Labor administration.

      Commenter
      Alternate View
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:44AM
    • I understand as of 1 July the NBN was 279000 connecting behind budget!

      Commenter
      impy
      Location
      tamworth
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:13PM
  • Why are all the PM's daily press conferences held in either schools or pre schools - no adult scrutiny perhaps?

    Commenter
    Baltic13
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 9:58AM
    • Its starting to get creepy.

      Commenter
      Sarah of Carnegie
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:05AM
    • Starting to wonder that myself. always at a per-school or school. hope he has a working with children's card LOL Also Kruud can you talk to us adults sometime or as usual your hiding.

      Commenter
      EDU IT
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:07AM
    • Because the ALP can't find an adult workplace that would support a Rudd government.

      Commenter
      Tim of Altona
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:23AM
    • The kids just really enjoy a show pony thats why!

      Commenter
      ultra
      Location
      Mel
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:35AM
    • Kids love a celebrity and know nothing about Rudd and poitics they also don't vote. Teacher tells them the PM is coming today please make sure you all clap an cheer! and of course being kids they do. Rudd is scared of adults as we saw when he had to debate Abbott.

      Commenter
      Karen
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:36AM
    • Rudd does not what to be challenged by anyone that has a higher IQ than him.

      Commenter
      terry
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:09AM
  • So will a journalists ask Kevin rudd why it was okay for him to release his full policies and costings less then 24 hours before the election in 2007, but Tony Abbott is expected to release them 4 weeks out? Sounds like more political trickery from Krudd.

    Commenter
    kp
    Location
    brisbane
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 9:58AM
  • "regressive taxes on the poor (GST etc)". Last time I checked 'rich' people also buy products subject to GST.

    Commenter
    Sick of this
    Location
    Adelaide
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 9:57AM
    • The thing is, everyone has to buy food. There are some things that need to remain outside of the GST.

      Commenter
      sarajane
      Location
      melbourne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:07AM
    • When the GST was proposed I was part of a team that did a lot of analysis of it. The effect on poorer people is that they spend a far larger proportion of this income on essentials, including especially food, rent, fuel. So placing a GST on those items is especially a problem for those people. It is by definition "regressive" as opposed to "progressive": in that it takes a higher proportion of those people's income than richer people's. This is the reason why GST is not charge on fresh food and rent. There was strong argument not to put it on heating fuel because that is highly regressive. But there you go, the old cold pensioner problem.

      Commenter
      Norm
      Location
      Maroubra
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:08AM
    • It's well documented economic fact that a GST impacts lower wage earners MORE because the cost of a GST is a higher percentage of their income. This is why the bottom half of the economy should resist a GST increase.

      Commenter
      QED
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:09AM
    • You need to take a tip from Hockey and buy a calculator. Yes the 'rich' purchase GST goods but then they can afford to absorb any possible increase, the poor can not. It's not rocket science.

      Commenter
      Future Looking
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:12AM
    • Last time I did maths if two people spend the same and pay the same amount of tax the one on the lower income has paid a greater percentage of their income in tax.its not rocket surgery to most of us....

      Commenter
      David D
      Location
      Ettalong Beach
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:13AM
    • Wealthy people spend more money and thus pay more gst

      Commenter
      Ecka
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:14AM
    • Thing is 'rich' people spend a lot more money and thus end up paying a lot more GST. I agree GST should not be applied but wake up people it's time the GST was increased. Sad thing is all the hysterical looneys out there will make sure it will never happen.

      Commenter
      Sick of this
      Location
      Adelaide
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:21AM
    • Well no doubt it's a jolly good way of emphasizing the difficulty of Black Spots in reception.
      If a policy release is released where no media can report on it its release immediately, does the lack of immediate reportage via twitterage, mean the release of the policy is not really truly a genuine policy release?

      Commenter
      A Country Girl
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:44AM
    • Depends wether or not you are business registered for GST and do not have to pay GST on many many things.
      I have Howard era Liebabel party satellite broadband, not one comment I have made so far today has been posted any where no matter how many times I send them, vote for Abbott you have to be bloody kidding!

      Commenter
      HFR
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:59AM
    • David D
      "Last time I did maths if two people spend the same and pay the same amount of tax......" the one on the lower income has paid a greater percentage of their income in tax.its not rocket surgery to most of us....

      A person on $50k a year pays about $7.7k income tax plus could get Govt benefits and could be a nett receiver and pay no tax at all. A person on $300k a year pays about 105k income tax and are unlikely to get any Govt benefits, for 6 times the salary they pay about 15 times the income tax than the person on $50k a year.
      Using the argument that the lower income people are more affected by the GST while in part is true, you have to include all taxes paid and any govt benefits received for all people to have a true reflection of how a tax will affected everyone.

      Commenter
      terry
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:25AM
    • 10.44 A Country Girl.
      Very similar moniker?
      But I tend to agree.
      I'll take it as a compliment.

      Commenter
      A country gal
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:30AM
    • It's not the bottom half that should resist a GST - it's more like the bottom 80%, who would have to pick up the tab from the really rich who will get away with paying less tax because they aren't impacted as much by the GST.

      Commenter
      Tone
      Location
      Melbourne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:49AM
    • its strange isn't it we buy a bed kitchen table at $400 plus gst of $40, wealthier people I know spent $15000 on their 10 seater Italian dinner suite that's $1500 gst (plus it was on interest free terms!). its best and fairest tax we have

      Commenter
      impy
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:08PM
    • Bill Gates himself said that consumption taxes are regressive, because there are limits to how much one can spend.

      Commenter
      Tone
      Location
      Melbourne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:08PM
    • Terry the comparison related to GST only; get that? GST only. That was the subject of the post.Not income tax. that is another subject entirely. And dont quote me on this, but wouldnt someone on $300k pa would be in a much better position to utilise various forms of middle class welfare such as neg gearing, salary sacrificing etc. Nah, they would just pay all their tax, wouldnt they.

      Commenter
      David D
      Location
      Ettalong Beach
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:09PM
    • David D
      A lot of low income people do not actually pay any tax other than the GST if you include any Govt benefits they receive.
      So of course they would pay a greater percentage of their income on the GST when compared to those on higher incomes.
      Whether the burden of the GST falls greater on the low income earners more than other income earners you have to include all taxes paid and Govt benefits received.

      "utilise various forms of middle class welfare such as neg gearing, salary sacrificing etc. "

      This options are available for all income earners but the higher income earners are more likely to have the spare cash or accept a level debt to do this things.

      Commenter
      terry
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:38PM
    • A country gal

      I fess up - it was me who accidentally got your moniker wrong and put it in the wrong place, cos I was out and about on my phone and was in a big hurry! Sorry about that.
      You don't have an impersonator after all!

      Commenter
      yys
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:59PM
    • yys, cheers has happened before though.
      At least black spore being addressed by whomever. It's a real problem.
      I know of many illegal boosters that attract a huge fine and rob neighbours transmissions from services being used.(not sure how it works) It needs to be addressed.
      The romance between the Nats and Libs is a bit tedious ATM though.

      Commenter
      A country gal
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:20PM
  • Rudd's dog whistle is loud and clear in the ears of the desperate rusted-ons.

    The GST card.

    Denied, denied, denied again , comprehensively, by Pyne last night.

    But still the Abbott haters spit and fume

    The tragedy of this election is the mediocrity and pettiness of the rusted-ons.

    How could anyone with even a modicum of intelligence wish for another 3 years of Labor?

    Commenter
    Louis Cypher
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 9:45AM
    • How could anyone with any sort of suppository of wisdom not want to know HOW Abbott is going to pay for the promises he has made?

      You understand that's why the GST issue won't go away don't you? Until Abbott explains HOW he will pay we have to assume a GST rise. What is your understanding of HOW he will pay?

      Commenter
      QED
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 9:51AM
    • That's strange. I thought we have freedom of speech, choice , and action. So you are not rusted on.

      Commenter
      Blokey
      Location
      Canberra
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 9:56AM
    • Some people will just never trust a leader who dosn't know the difference between a suppository and a repository.

      Commenter
      sarajane
      Location
      melbourne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:02AM
    • @QED - take you head out of the sand for a minute. There are plenty of ways to fund election promises without GST. Besides GST is a tax used to fund the states.

      All will be revealed in good time. The LNP has until the day before the election to say how it will fund promises just like Rudd in 2007.

      We still have not heard from Rudd how the better schools program will be funded. Oh and the $200m for Holden and the other $450m hat was promised on day one of this campaign.

      Commenter
      Paul B
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:09AM
    • You crack me up QED. So quick to jump to your Pro Labor Convulsions X V SORRY meant 'Conclusions'.

      Commenter
      yys
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:20AM
    • Paul B – This isn’t some footy game where one side got a free kick so the other side gets one too. This is about us knowing how these political parties will govern our country. It’s about whether we have jobs to feed our families. BOTH sides should be forced to explain how they plan to tax us and spend our tax dollars.

      Yes, there are lots of ways to take tax, some of them good and others come straight out of our pockets. I don’t trust either party, but I trust Abbott less because every other policy he has favours big business over workers.

      FYI – GST going to the states is something legislated and can be just as easily changed to go to the Federal government. If you are an actual voter and not just a paid shill you will want to know HOW you will be taxed. Only a total fool would be so accepting and compliant being told minutes before you vote how billions of dollars of taxation will be taken.

      Commenter
      QED
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:38AM
    • yys – I see what you did there – trying to make a joke about some word that no-one said in an embarrassing way – just like I did with Abbott’s ‘suppository of wisdom’ gaf. Except he actually said that. Every day he reminds me more of George W.

      PS Did you actually have a point? Other than incorrectly implying that I’m pro Labor? I’m just pro good government and at the moment there are no good options but one of them is being dangerously unrevealing.

      Commenter
      QED
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:49AM
    • Rudd should stop sounding so desperate. Then again maybe he shouldn't, it only helps the Coalition. Abbott said NO! Everyone has heard Abbott say it.
      If there were to be any changes it would be taken to the next election and the electorate would vote on it!
      If I were a Labor supporter I would be embarassed at Rudds childish unfounded scare campaign.

      Commenter
      Alice
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:00AM
    • Alice - if you believe anything Abbott says at this point in the campaign you must be living in Wonderland.

      Commenter
      tim bob
      Location
      'bra
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:15AM
    • Tim bob - is that the best you and your line of Labor chorus singers can come up with?
      Seriously, you can say that about anyone especially Kevin Rudd. Try and find something with a little meat on the bones to parrot on about at least.

      Commenter
      Luke
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:27AM
    • QED @ 10.49

      My point was that you are jumping to incorrect conclusions.
      Did you ever study venn diagrams at school?
      If all taxes are being reviewed by the Coalition, then all taxes need to go in the circle labelled Taxes, other things like Insulation Batts, Grocery Watch, Fuel Watch, BER overspend would go in another circle labelled Labor Waste.

      Commenter
      yys
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:04PM
    • @QED I never said it was a football game - is that what you think this is a football game? Also I am not a paid shill and for future please leave your quirky stupid comments in the bottom draw where they belong - they add zero to any conversation.

      Please read my comment again. The LNP has until the last day of the election campaign to reveal their costed policies just like Rudd did in 2007.

      Commenter
      Paul B
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:11PM
  • The budget deficit will always be smaller under the so-called Liberals (certainly they are liberal with the truth) because of their handouts to big business and their wealthy supporters, regressive taxes on the poor (GST etc) and outsourcing of things such as calculators so the voter mugs can do their sums for them.

    Commenter
    Allan
    Location
    Melbourne
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 9:40AM
  • 2007

    Swan - The" world's greatest treasurer".

    Released costings at 5.00 pm, the day preceding the election

    Dumb ,or duplicitous?

    Perhaps the rusted-ons are a little of both?

    Commenter
    Louis Cypher
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 9:39AM
    • I don't know what happened in 2007. But what I do know is that a party that is campaigning on financial rectitude can hardly used as its model someone they complain is the opposite!

      Commenter
      Whyalla Wipeout
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:50AM
  • Opposition costing’s.. the light on the hill for a desperate government campaign. If the LNP don't give detailed costing’s they are hiding. If they do give detailed costing’s challenge them and declare a black hole.. too easy. We don't know if Labor will claim the costing’s are hidden or if the costing’s don't add up, either way they get to say "Black hole" and run the hyperbolic GST scare campaign. Labor has nothing else to lose so they may as well go for it. Deep down we all love a good scare campaign.

    Commenter
    Cwitty
    Location
    Sydney
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 9:38AM
    • You sure do love a scare campaign! The whole Abbott campaign is based on them. Scare campaign about boat people taking over the country, scare campaign over our relatively low debt, scare campaign about an 'economic emergency', etc etc

      None of the above are real issues. One of the party's inability or unwillingness to tell us HOW they will pay for their promises is in terms of voting, a real issue. Only a fool would publicly support or vote for a party that has not revealed it's costings.

      Commenter
      QED
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:16AM
    • The Coalition are the last people on Earth who can complain about a scare campaign. We've had 6 years of nothing but scare campaigns out of them. Fear the mining tax! Fear the carbon tax! Fear the boats!

      My problem with this scare campaign on the GST is it just isn't a very good one.

      Commenter
      Arky
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:30AM
    • black the only black hole I can see in worth $360Billion deficit that currently requires $13 billion in payments for the next 20 plus years do your sums on that! And whilst i'm on my high horse newscorp hate Labor coz they are bad for the economy and therefore business whats fairfaxes excuse do they want to go down the gurgler. amazing stuff

      Commenter
      impy
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:35AM
    • As one of the wittier commenators said, nobody knows what a scare campaign looks like as much as Abbott - a man who has lived and breathed scare campaigns as long as he has been in power.

      And even today, he gets away with them.

      Commenter
      Whyalla Wipeout
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:49AM
    • QED "Only a fool would publicly support or vote for a party that has not revealed it's costings."

      I take it you didn't vote Labor in 2007 then? And, of course, you were scathing of how dangerously uninformative they were weren't you.

      Commenter
      Bakayarou
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:14PM
    • QED - You seem to be doing pretty well yourself with the GST when it comes to scare campaigns in behalf of the ALP. GST scare campaigns are a favourite of the ALP - Just ask Greg Combet.

      Commenter
      Smack
      Location
      City of the Fallen
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:54PM
    • Were still waiting now on the ALP's costings, a blank page isn't costings but a blank page.

      Commenter
      treasury
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 2:34PM
    • Smack - suggesting that Abbott might need to increase the GST is not a scare campaign when there are no other options available to the Libs. All he needs to do is explain how he will pay for his promises.

      Commenter
      QED
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:54PM
  • An interesting discussion on Lateline last night between Malcolm and Albo. Talk about a contrast in competence! Even with the help of Emma, Albo stuggled to look like he had the remotest idea of the broadest of details of the NBN, let alone any of the most important details, like ultra high speed access fees.

    At one stage he claimed that NBN internet access costs would fall (as they have historically pre NBN) and was unable to explain how the business case for the NBN is based on a steady (and considerable) rise in the forecast revenues per user. Nice one.

    He also denied that the (latest) revision of the NBN business plan was available (Malcolm asserted that it was) and would not commit to releasing it prior to the election of course.

    What a shambles the NBN is. Should the coalition win the election, no doubt the current lack of transparency will be explained in short order, exposing the truth about it's shortcomings.

    Commenter
    Alternate View
    Location
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 9:26AM
    • After the election it will be revealed whether Albo was fibbing last night about the release of the NBN report prior to the election.

      I suspect the report does not look good for the government as Turnbull alludes.

      The big red "Draft" stamp sitting on Albo's desk has had a big workout.

      Commenter
      Tim of Altona
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 9:51AM
    • You TV must have a special filter that gives the viewer a desired outcome. Considerinding Turnbull has been opposition spokesperson for 3 years and Albo Communications Minister for little more than a month, I thought he was extremely well versed with the details. The NBN is THE policy that will define our future for decades. The continual upgrading and discrimination with a "copper cans and string plan" just doesn't come anywhere near the cost effectiveness and ability of the NBN. Do it once, and do it right!

      Commenter
      A country gal
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:05AM
    • of course 'fraudband' has no shortcomings does it? I mean it doesn't matter that it will have to be upgraded to FTTH in the short term costing billions does it? It doesn't matter that the wireless capacity is a furphy then? Turnbull knows the shortcomings of fraudband he just can't say it anymore.

      Commenter
      Future Looking
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:08AM
    • I assumed that the income from the NBN being budgeted to stay stable was because over time more households will connect. But yes Albo should have been able to explain this.

      Commenter
      QED
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:12AM
    • AGC,

      Albo is sprouting the NBN will deliver 1GB speed to houses. How fantastic! At what cost Albo "I don't know, it will be market driven"...
      Well Malcolm knows - at the moment it would cost approx. $20k per month.
      ACG, can you please just look up Telstra or any other NBN retailer and let me know what their NBN plan costs for 1GB speeds?

      Commenter
      beasleyst
      Location
      Sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:23AM
    • Future Looking,

      Albo used the old "why build a 2 lane harbour bridge crossing" line.
      My response: "Why build a 6 lane highway to every street, lane way and driveway of every house in Australia?"

      Have a look at the retail plans from Telstra etc,. You can only get up to 100Mbs at your home anyway.

      Commenter
      dRod
      Location
      Sydney
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:28AM
    • QED.,

      No, the income PER USER is forecast to increase steadily over time in the last NBN business plan. Contrary to what Albo said and against what has been happening worldwide.

      The whole fraud of the NBN is close to being exposed now. The reality of the situation is that even if the NBN CAN provide faster speeds than the alternative plan (and that is now not assured due to recent improvements in copper transmission technology as Malcolm indicated), it is clear that most people either don't actually need the outright speeds claimed, or afford the cost.

      The best part of the programme for me was when Albo proudly claimed that Australia was getting the NBN because is "they deserve the best". Shades of Yes Minister.

      Commenter
      Alternate View
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:31AM
    • Copper lines are absolute rubbish and the core of the inferiority that exists in the Liberal Party's NBN. No matter how good the copper wires, they will always have crosstalk, and will always suffer from significant deterioration over time. The cost of maintaining the copper wires, which the Liberal Party have not put in their costings, is $1 Billion per year.

      That means that in less than 10 years we will have paid the same price as the Labor NBN, but will have the Liberal Party's inferior NBN.

      Because Labor's NBN is based on fibre optic cables, the speed is limited by the speed of light. Copper can never achieve the speeds of fibre. It is physically impossible, especially due to interference.

      In optical fibre, there is no interference. At all. Zippo. Zilch. Optical fibre can reach speeds in the petabytes. The theoretical maximum for copper is about 100Mbps, which is unlikely to ever be achieved by the Liberal government, which won't want those speeds competing with Rupert Murdoch's cable network anyway. Liberals are only offering essentially ADSL2+ to your house. ADSL2+ is rubbish.

      Commenter
      Tone
      Location
      Melbourne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:41PM
    • The world is moving to fibre, but not Oz under Dr No. He'll have have stuck at 25MbS for decades and then spend $100B to upgrade to fibre later........ smart guy, but Murdoch approves.

      Commenter
      FrankM
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 12:56PM
    • Agree with you.
      ACG - the minister for everything Albo is just like Rudd will say and do anything to win a vote.
      Tone - settle down. Do you work for Telstra? Is that how you know how much it costs to maintain the copper infrastructure? You seem to have a comment (mainly negative) for everything.

      Have you heard of gigabyte squared. A new technology that make use of copper, fibre and wireless to provide real internet speeds that people can and do use. Check it out on the internet - being rolled out to Seattle and Chicago. A fraction of the cost of NBN - so I understand.

      Commenter
      Paul B
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 3:57PM
    • I just looked up Gigabyte squared and they are using fibre to the home!

      From engadget: "Ultra-high-speed fiber-to-the-home from Gigabit Squared isn't scheduled to light up Seattle until 2014, but the outfit's just revealed what it aims to charge for its blisteringly-fast internet service."

      There are no doubts about it, the Liberal Party NBN will be obsolete before it is ever implemented.

      Commenter
      Tone
      Location
      Melbourne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:42PM
    • I have also looked at the cost. They can do Gigabit speeds in the US for around US$80 per month. 100Mbps speed is available for around US$45 a month. Malcolm Turnbull is just making things up if he is suggesting it will be $20,000 a month for Gigabit speeds. The Liberal Party are so deceitful on this, but I guess they have to be because of their lame duck policy.

      Commenter
      Tone
      Location
      Melbourne
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:47PM
  • After the release of PEFO
    I expect there will be SUPPOSITion about Hockeys Hidden Horrors......

    Commenter
    David D
    Location
    Ettalong Beach
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 9:20AM
    • Hockey and Robb now on TV now trying to look serious about the emergency situation you're gotta laugh, I've just come back from three years in Portugal!!!

      Commenter
      amro
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 1:29PM
  • One big question for PEFO is about growth and unemployment. Apparently in 2015-16 growth will be low but unemployment will fall from 6.25% to 5% - a dramatic drop in a flat economy. The red ink fingerprints of Swan still loom large over the budget.

    Will Parkinson and Tune stand by these rubbery numbers, or will they de-Laborise the fiscal statement ?

    Commenter
    Hacka
    Location
    Canberra
    Date and time
    August 13, 2013, 9:12AM
    • Yes Hacka, lots of grey areas, but nothing like the huge black-hole that is HOW Abbott will pay for his promises. I'll start to look into the minor numbers discrepancies once this show stopper hole is explained.

      Commenter
      QED
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 9:53AM
    • What a slow day eh? Hacka doesn't comment until 9:12 and the first punch doesn't land on him until 9:53!

      Commenter
      Norm
      Location
      Maroubra
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 10:59AM
    • QED those "minor discrepancies" have led to a $300 billion debt. Not exactly minor.

      Commenter
      Hacka
      Location
      Canberra
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 11:09AM
    • Hacka - agreed. Just look at when Bowen and Wong signed the document. August 7, 6 days ago. (From the downloaded document on Treasury website).

      Commenter
      Paul B
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:01PM
    • Just a little question for you Hacka?

      How big is the black hole that Hockey and Abbott is hiding. It was $11 billion in 2010. It must be at least $70 billion now.

      Of course, you know that they they will just slash and burn and like Howard in 1996 are cowardly hiding their real agenda.

      Commenter
      Whyalla Wipeout
      Location
      Date and time
      August 13, 2013, 4:42PM
Comments are now closed