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Politics Live: May 27, 2014

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  • I see there is a Oz Lotto draw tonight - my chances of winning are better than a lot of the Budget measures getting through the Senate

    Commenter
    As If
    Date and time
    May 27, 2014, 5:55PM
    • The Office For Women should be over and done with fairly swiftly.

      Commenter
      A country gal
      Date and time
      May 27, 2014, 5:52PM
      • Picture of Malcolm at 5.03pm.
        Careful Malcolm, straighten up lest you look like one of those leaners so despised and demonised by the LNP.

        Commenter
        Lyn
        Date and time
        May 27, 2014, 5:13PM
        • So a token dismissal of a Coalition member, suddenly now! Smells a lot like someone has had a word in her ear. "Hey Bronny make it look like you aren't completely biased, make a token suspension"What a joke of a Government!

          Commenter
          Rosie
          Date and time
          May 27, 2014, 5:09PM
          • "And Philip Dorling reports on the surveillance of Labor senator John Faulkner's office. Senate Clerk Rosemary Laing has said there is a "reasonably strong possibility" that a contempt of the Senate was committed by Department of Parliamentary Services officials."

            This is going to be a really serious issue I think. Parliament is not just a workplace but has special rule because it is the Parliament of Australia. It is not party political, not only because the events occurred while Labor was in power but because Members and Senators of all persuasions are incredibly protective of their privileges.

            For those of us who watch Parliament closely, it is not going to go away I think.

            Commenter
            Whyalla Wipeout
            Date and time
            May 27, 2014, 5:06PM
            • WW, obviously a lot more to this, but why Faulkner I consider him as pretty straight, transparent. One I do respect.
              Is the so called "whistleblower" just an excuse? Haven't followed it closely but it has a stench.

              Commenter
              A country gal
              Date and time
              May 27, 2014, 5:50PM
          • Nice evil villain shot of Christopher Pyne enjoying his playtime. To think, we actually pay Dr Evil to behave like this? A thousand dollars a smirk! One token eviction from the house of an LNP lackey (who has a big satisfied smile on his face as he leaves....knowing that he's played his token role to allow Bishop to refute claims that she's an LNP biased muppet) doth not make an unbiased, independent speaker. The record and her actions speak for themselves. There's going to have to be a hell of a lot more "token" evictions of LNP ministers before anyone could ever take this circus seriously...and stop letting Pyne give instructions to Bishop. That's not an independent speaker by any means and makes a sham of our democracy. In fact this whole lying government are a living example of democracy's death throes. Oh and gym wear is NOT a good look in parliament.

            Commenter
            PaxUs
            Location
            Austerelia
            Date and time
            May 27, 2014, 5:06PM
            • MPs should put aside their differences so "the people of Australia can indeed feel more proud of us".

              WHAT ABOUT SPEAKERS

              Commenter
              Akcah (opposite of Hacka)
              Date and time
              May 27, 2014, 4:35PM
              • What I really want to know about the post QT matter, was any MP caught in his gym shorts again.

                Commenter
                mitch of ACT
                Date and time
                May 27, 2014, 4:33PM
                • Anyone in particular you fancy?

                  Commenter
                  A country gall
                  Date and time
                  May 27, 2014, 4:48PM
              • A Country Gal

                Thanks, it worked.

                Cheers

                Commenter
                Pen of hrba
                Date and time
                May 27, 2014, 4:32PM
                • Pleasure.

                  Commenter
                  A country gall
                  Date and time
                  May 27, 2014, 4:43PM
                • Aghhh look at you two setting the decorum example. Sweet. If only Mr Burke could follow the example of his fan club, we would have a more polite chamber.

                  Commenter
                  Cwitty
                  Location
                  Sydney
                  Date and time
                  May 27, 2014, 5:06PM
                • Yeah Yeah we know Cwitty - "Its all Labor's fault".

                  Commenter
                  Lyn
                  Date and time
                  May 27, 2014, 5:31PM
              • Wow, what an absolute waste of time that was. I can't believe my taxes go to paying these people...

                Commenter
                Alex
                Location
                Melbourne
                Date and time
                May 27, 2014, 4:29PM
                  • I don't get the political value of that stunt. To the extent that it gets any airplay on the TV broadcasts, it will just make the average (not politically interested) voter wonder what the Government is doing. I cannot see anyone thinking it reflects on a sound government actually governing - which is what Australians want to see.

                    Commenter
                    Whyalla Wipeout
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 4:59PM
                • Albo - if you reckon that's the most childish stunt you've seen you must have been absent for the misogyny speech, or the one where naughty Mr Abbott dared to look at his watch.

                  Commenter
                  Hacka
                  Location
                  Canberra
                  Date and time
                  May 27, 2014, 4:22PM
                  • The misogyny speech was on of the great Parliamentary moments of the 21st century. Provided inspiration to women everywhere.
                    Hacka, you've let your sex down. Perhaps you had better go back to the kitchen to iron your husband's shirts and cook his tea. He'll be hungry when he gets home after lording it over the women at work.

                    Commenter
                    mitch of ACT
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 4:31PM
                  • It was not childish of Gillard,to immediately after Abbott accused her Government of protecting a "misogynist", responding in kind with evidence of his sexism and given all the evidence of this on the public record, that if he wanted to know what misogyny looked like he only needed a mirror?
                    It has never been widely reported that Abbott used the word first on that day in his speech to Parliament that immediately preceded Gillard's speech and in that she responded, justifiably in my view, in kind.
                    If Gillard was childish then so was Abbott.
                    The watch stuff was pathetic but it shows how disliked Abbott was that a fairly trivial thing ( somewhat like the wink, although the wink was more worthy of criticism being indicative of a certain attitude and thinking and lack of control) was used to try and discredit him.

                    Commenter
                    Lyn
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 4:41PM
                  • That's hilarious mitch - first you attack supposed gender discrimination, then you follow it up with .... gender discrimination !

                    Can you see the irony ? Thought not.

                    Commenter
                    Hacka
                    Location
                    Canberra
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 4:48PM
                  • Hacka says-
                    Windmill - the Medicare surcharge, just like tax rates, isn't indexed. Apart from that i have no idea what you're talking about pausing it.

                    Hacka
                    Part 1 of 3

                    Are you really that ignorant or are your just trying to avoid admitting that the LNP have snuck a nasty tax increase in through the back door.

                    There are TWO taxes associated with Medicare.

                    One is called a LEVY and the second is called a SURCHARGE.

                    Everyone who has a taxable income pays the levy tax and it is not indexed at all, apart from the rate going up like it is doing on July 1st.

                    The surcharge is a purely ideological 1% extra tax on your entire taxable income, introduced without a mandate by Howard in the 1996 budget.
                    It kicks in at a certain threshold (I think its $86,000 for singles and $170,000 for families) if you have chosen for legitimate reasons, not to take out private health insurance. In the eleven years of Howard this threshold was not indexed so inflation and bracket creep pushed more people every year over the threshold, effectively lowering the threshold each year.

                    By 2007, 450,000 people were paying this tax raking in over $3 billion a year for the government. A nice little earner but very unethical.

                    Rudd increased the threshold to what he considered a reasonable and equitable level (though the tax is still unethical as its purpose is for the government to tell you how to spend your after tax income and its a disincentive to earn more money that would put you over the threshold, if you have chosen not to take out private health insurance.

                    Rudd indexed the threshold so inflation and bracket creep did not have the nasty effect they had under Howard.

                    Commenter
                    Windmill
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 4:49PM
                  • Worst thing is, Hacka, is that we'll probably get about 14 chapters from "My Life" devoted to hearing Jool's take of how she smote the barbarian misogynists both hip and thigh and freed all women from tyranny .....

                    Commenter
                    Smack
                    Location
                    City of the Fallen
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 4:51PM
                  • Hacka
                    part2

                    Hockey has paused the indexation of the surcharge threshold, effectively lowering it over the forward estimates and its a good bet that this is a permanent stopping of indexation and not a pause. Even a pause is unethical and a lie and a broken promise.

                    Pausing the Medicare levy surcharge is not an expenditure saving as Hockey claimed in the budget. Its a tax hike, as Dutton admitted to Uhlmann on AM.

                    So single Hacka earning $85,999 does not pay any surcharge tax if Hacka does not have private health insurance.
                    But if Hacka earns $1 more, then Hacka's tax bill goes up by $860.
                    For showing initiative and earning $1 more Hacka will pay $860 tax on that $1.
                    That's some incredible effective tax rate.

                    Budget paper #2 says
                    “Pausing indexation of ....some Medicare Benefits Schedule fees and the Medicare Levy Surcharge and Private Health Insurance Rebate thresholds

                    The Government will achieve savings of $1.7 billion over five years by pausing the indexation of some Medicare Benefits Schedule (MBS) fees for two years from 1 July 2014 and the income thresholds for the Medicare Levy Surcharge and Private Health Insurance Rebate for three years from 1 July 2015.”

                    If this statement is true, then we can remove two of the indexation references and the remaining statement will still be true

                    So the statement becomes:

                    The Government will achieve savings by pausing the indexation of the income thresholds for the Medicare Levy Surcharge for three years from 1 July 2015.

                    This is false as this measure will in fact raise revenue for the government. Hockey has lied and broken a promise in this sentence,as Dutton, using weasel words, admitted to Uhlmann on AM.

                    Commenter
                    Windmill
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 4:51PM
                  • Hacka, how about the one where the leadership of the Parliamentary Liberal Party started sprinting around the chamber and crashing into closed doors in order to avoid voting on their own motion?

                    Commenter
                    Whyalla Wipeout
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 4:53PM
                  • Ask yourself, in ten year's time, which will be most remembered, Gillard's mysogyny speech, or Pyne's gross calumny speech?

                    The one speech Pyne should be remembered for, if he's remembered at all, is his "You're such a grub" oration (using as it did the unusual South Australian pronunciation of 'grub' which ends with a 't').

                    Commenter
                    Gigondas
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 4:54PM
                  • Hacka
                    Part3

                    Shortens questions to Dutton or Hockey should be - Is pausing the indexation of the medicare levy surcharge an expenditure saving as claimed in the budget or a revenue raiser? It's a tax increase isn't it?

                    Supplementary question to Hockey - Whats the %effective tax rate of $860 tax on that $1 that is earned over the medicare levy surcharge threshold?

                    Commenter
                    Windmill
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 4:55PM
                  • yep the Misogamy speech was appalling. Gillard was trying to protect the 2 votes she needed , one by a member who used union funds to pay for hookers, the other a kicked out liberal who has many colourful ways to describe female genitals. She then said TA hates women which must include his wife , daughters and sister. Then the ALP tried to change the meaning in the dictionary! Yep it was atrocious. If that speech had have been given in another time about the former speaker it would have been more justified. Still the sisters got to stick together hey?

                    Commenter
                    Brettie
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 4:56PM
                  • @Hacka, no I was making a a point about misogyny and gender discrimination. And what better way to do that than give you real-life examples. Do I, like Leonard in TBBT, need to hold up a sign when I am being ironic, so that you and Sheldon understand.

                    Commenter
                    mitch of ACT
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 5:09PM
                  • Hacka try every time sniveling Pyne steps up

                    Commenter
                    Get Real
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 5:10PM
                  • Bertie, just a minor detail, but one I find a bit disingenuous. Why has the PM never acknowledged his other sister? Not good enough to market or what?
                    The overwhelming majority I expect would not realise he has in fact two sisters. Not just one who is openly gay.
                    Just as many who didn't take much notice thought he only had two daughters.

                    Commenter
                    A country gal
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 5:13PM
                  • @Mitch,

                    You must be kidding. Gillard's misogyny speech was a disgrace, and ultimately sealed the nail in her political coffin as it was soon after that she was knifed by her own colleagues - not exactly a ringing endorsement of her performance - many of whom were women I might add. She was a poor politician and both the caucus and the electorate agreed. Her gender had nothing to do with it, but her argument otherwise was a large part of her downfall. We are a better country without her leading it *Note: I'm no fan of Tony either.

                    Commenter
                    Llama Farma
                    Location
                    Canberra
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 5:26PM
                  • Sorry a counrty gil.. Sisters I meant to say

                    Commenter
                    Brettie
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 5:27PM
                  • Smack if that's the worst thing, then as I suspect is the case for many LNPers, you have lived a life of privilege and entitlement and are out of touch with the reality of life for most ordinary Australians and particularly the low income earners and welfare recipients and you do not have the imagination to try to see things through their eyes.
                    The solution to the worst thing ever is pretty simple - dont buy or read it.
                    You should think of writing a work of faction, including a chapter "My fantastical imaginings about what Julia Gillard will write in her book that I can then use to baselessly denigrate her". Should be a dull read.

                    Commenter
                    Lyn
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 5:28PM
                  • ACG - Perhaps the other sister doesn't want to be publically attacked for going to the wrong school etc or have some-one going through her garbage at 4am in the morning looking for dirt to fling at her brother in the off chance it might damage him politically....

                    Commenter
                    Smack
                    Location
                    City of the Fallen
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 5:29PM
                  • Smack. I agree, respect and value her reasons for wanting privacy. Perhaps the point I should make clearer is that the other one, the famous one has been used to create an appearance for him during the campaign, of being gay friendly. One extreme to the other. Merely an observation on the marketing potential, when required.

                    Commenter
                    A country gal
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 5:46PM
                  • Mitch - whilst a small piece of satire was detected, your post still gets an epic fail.

                    Why is it you lefties always go the personal sledge as soon there's nothing better to say ?

                    Whyalla - well you're right, that was childish, but hardly insulting to anyone.

                    Commenter
                    Hacka
                    Location
                    Canberra
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 5:49PM
                • I think Labor should boycott all future QTs until Bishop is removed as Speaker. QT has become a mockery of its intended purpose under her stewardship.. Instead Labor should hold a round of press conferences giving their point of view on gov't policy that would provide far more interesting news feed for TV than QT ever could. A great form of electioneering as well.

                  Commenter
                  mitch of ACT
                  Date and time
                  May 27, 2014, 4:20PM
                  • Fully support you mitch. Then the budget could pass, and good governance return.

                    Commenter
                    Hacka
                    Location
                    Canberra
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 4:39PM
                  • The Budget will pass in the Reps anyway to be knocked down in the Senate. The message is clear. NEVER give the same party control of both Houses. Workchoices was John Howard's gift the last time the same party controlled both Houses.

                    Commenter
                    mitch of ACT
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 4:45PM
                  • At least one day to make a point to the nation or at least those who don't know what's going on with Bishop as speaker.

                    Commenter
                    RTP
                    Location
                    Sawtell
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 4:51PM
                  • Hacka, like this stupid motion the stupid budget will pass the lower house on the numbers anyway.

                    It is in the Senate where the numbers matter - and the President of the Senate is a sensible and mature person who actually does credit to the position he holds.

                    Commenter
                    Whyalla Wipeout
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 4:55PM
                  • Oh Hacka you keep digging deeper than Joe and Tony have.

                    Commenter
                    Get Real
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 5:11PM
                • I Shorten had any bottle he would have his union mates organise a national strike, in protest of the Coalition's budget of discrimination.

                  Commenter
                  Pen of hrba
                  Date and time
                  May 27, 2014, 4:20PM
                  • There will be a strike but it will be a buyers' strike as consumers keep their wallets and purses shut. Big business and gov't tax collections will feel the pain very quickly.

                    Commenter
                    mitch of ACT
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 4:40PM
                  • He hasn't got the bottle Pen. They should also do a Rainsey and Boycott QT.

                    Commenter
                    A country gall
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 4:40PM
                • No Pyne at 3.21.
                  It wasn't right when Labor used the Speaker's Office in 1990 to fund raise for party political purposes and it isn't right now.
                  The current Labor politicians are not responsible for what Labor did in 1990 but LNP giving it a good go to spin it that way.
                  Must have someone to blame or an excuse for LNP's bad behaviour or failings.
                  Sounds like yet another excuse and blaming for something that is completely owned by the LNP. LNP adults MIA.

                  Commenter
                  Lyn
                  Date and time
                  May 27, 2014, 4:15PM
                  • Hi Lyn - Do you understand how the word "precedent" might apply in this situation?

                    Commenter
                    Smack
                    Location
                    City of the Fallen
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 4:47PM
                  • Smack my how desperate the all high and mighty have become.

                    Commenter
                    Get Real
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 5:16PM
                  • Yes Get Real - Seems some people's memories of what has passed before are longer than others eh?

                    Commenter
                    Smack
                    Location
                    City of the Fallen
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 5:31PM
                  • What do you think Smack, seeing as I am lawyer?

                    Commenter
                    Lyn
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 5:38PM
                • Surely this must be the end of Browyn Bishop, she single handedly has turned our parliament into a farce. Her biased role as speaker is disgraceful and she must be moved on to greener pastures and very quickly before the next two years see our parliamentary system degenerate even further.

                  Commenter
                  RTP
                  Location
                  Sawtell
                  Date and time
                  May 27, 2014, 4:15PM
                  • Err QT has always been a farce, at least for the last 40 years, it was called in those days verbal diarrhoea.

                    Commenter
                    Pen of hrba
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 4:28PM
                • With the Budget selling fiasco the government has embarked on, Arthur Sinodinis but must be loving a little ICAC induced down time.

                  Commenter
                  Immal
                  Location
                  Melbourne
                  Date and time
                  May 27, 2014, 4:11PM
                  • It's curious that the dive in consumer confidence over the past two weeks hasn't created as much interest as it should. This is obviously a direct result of the budget. It will in turn hurt business, as people close their wallets and purses.

                    We may indeed be heading towards the recession we didn't need to have.

                    Commenter
                    Gigondas
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 4:08PM
                    • It's justice in a way. The Budget was brought in to please big business but big business is going to cop it in the revenue line as consumers keep their wallets shut. An economy cannot prosper unless consumers feel confident and this Budget has destroyed that confidence.

                      Commenter
                      mitch of ACT
                      Date and time
                      May 27, 2014, 4:13PM
                  • Sounds like Tony Burke is about to get, at least, a verbal comeuppance over his dogged & continued pursuit of the Speaker Bronwyn Bishop. The snide remarks about witches and the like from Burke are coming home to roost. Burke can look forward to being sat down in the future more times then Swanny promised a budget surplus.

                    Commenter
                    Smack
                    Location
                    City of the Fallen
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 4:04PM
                    • Smack - that's about 536 times at last count, but don't expect to read about it in "The Good Fight: 6 years, 2 PM's and 536 promised surpluses, 4 of them rolled, gold" or whatever the book's called.

                      Commenter
                      Hacka
                      Location
                      Canberra
                      Date and time
                      May 27, 2014, 4:17PM
                    • Actually I think he is being kind to her. She deserves much worse. Biassed is to generous a description of behavoir.
                      Swanny kept you in a job and for that you should be very grateful. It's unlikely with Jo at the helm you will keep it, but hey we may have a surplus.

                      Commenter
                      KIDDING
                      Date and time
                      May 27, 2014, 4:20PM
                    • Hey Kidding - The surest thing is this world is that Swanny didn't keep me in my job - I kept me in my job period!!....

                      Commenter
                      Smack
                      Location
                      City of the Fallen
                      Date and time
                      May 27, 2014, 4:43PM
                    • 536? That sounds like the number of Liberal broken promises since the election.

                      Commenter
                      Tone
                      Location
                      Melbourne
                      Date and time
                      May 27, 2014, 4:48PM
                  • Our Prime Minister really is a winker!

                    Commenter
                    sir fitzy of kogarah
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 4:03PM
                    • i = a

                      Commenter
                      Mr Ed
                      Date and time
                      May 27, 2014, 4:58PM
                  • You only have to listen to Parliament question time to hear Shorten and Labor's inability of being able to defend the indefensible, and the Liberal party ramming it down their throats, which proves we now have the right people in control.

                    Commenter
                    Garry of Melbourne
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 3:57PM
                    • I think you mis-typed.
                      The "Far Right" people in control.

                      Commenter
                      Lyn
                      Date and time
                      May 27, 2014, 4:04PM
                    • Which coverage were you listening to, Garry? The one I was listening to quite clearly demonstrated Tony's inability to defend the indefensible. Confusingly, Tony says some bloke called Bob Hawke would do a better job at running the country.

                      Commenter
                      Vacqueyras
                      Date and time
                      May 27, 2014, 4:04PM
                    • That's peculiar. I listen to QT as punishment for my sins and all I hear is the Libs refusing to answer the questions asked so as to avoid accountability for the wrongs they are seeking to inflict on the electorate.

                      Commenter
                      mitch of ACT
                      Date and time
                      May 27, 2014, 4:09PM
                    • So you are in favour that we suffer Abbott appeasing Washington by increasing defence spending to $30.5 billion (2% of GDP per annum), yet not one regional power, including China, is capable of invading Australia.

                      We appease the Catholic Church by spending $245.3 million on religion in schools.

                      You want cuts by stealth overall future education funding.

                      And cuts to pensions by increasing the age of accessibility.

                      Giving middle income earners with the best parental leave while ensuring the states have little choice than to cut public hospital funding including anti natal care.

                      The poor and low income earners a system by which visiting a doctor is unaffordable.

                      That we have absolutely nothing regarding climate change other than tearing all climate change authorities down.

                      You simply love the lies about the running costs of F35 fighter jets which we will never use to protect Australia.

                      Like Howard you too want the sell of more public owned assets to accomplish a surplus and brag about his superior skills of fiscal mismanagement dressed as management.

                      You despise that our self- interest dictates we rid ourselves of both oligarchs and stop the insane of practice of claiming one is superior to the other when they are both sullied by the same brush.

                      Commenter
                      Pen of hrba
                      Date and time
                      May 27, 2014, 4:16PM
                  • Pyne's suspension of standing orders and demand for an aology is one of the most appalling abuses of parliament I have seen.
                    There are much more important things for the government to act on and this is a pathetic act of diversion.
                    Can the public move a motion of no confidence outside of elections?

                    Commenter
                    stevek
                    Location
                    Sydney
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 3:55PM
                    • I suggest you're being naive if you expect more from the whole lot of them.

                      Commenter
                      Lewis
                      Location
                      Sydney
                      Date and time
                      May 27, 2014, 4:04PM
                    • No, I've endured sitting through a couple of QTs to know enough that they are usually a waste of time if you are seeking answers to something we didn't already know. But surely Pyne's motion to force an apology to Dolores about a perceived insult which she effectively brought upon herself by her biased conduct, plain to all.

                      Commenter
                      stevek
                      Location
                      Sydney
                      Date and time
                      May 27, 2014, 4:12PM
                  • This has got to be the most disingenuous motion since parliament opened it's doors in 1901.

                    Commenter
                    KIDDING
                    Date and time
                    May 27, 2014, 3:42PM
                    • gee, Luke is that what you call a filibuster?

                      Commenter
                      A country gal
                      Date and time
                      May 27, 2014, 3:39PM
                      • Judith, (3:36), I'm not sure about rabbit holes, but this Parliament is surely disappearing somewhere fundament..al.

                        Commenter
                        Gigondas
                        Date and time
                        May 27, 2014, 3:39PM
                        • It's not worth watching anymore. Best just to read about it here. Most of it is a waste of time and money. Once a question has been asked it should not be allowed to be asked again. They should all got on with fixing the country.

                          Commenter
                          Rod
                          Location
                          the Coast
                          Date and time
                          May 27, 2014, 3:58PM
                      • I am led to believe by PB that Manus is no less than an adventure in paradise, despite barb and razor wire to aid the comfort of confinement. We have had beatings the odd sexual abuse and a murder to help with Manus ambience of a day dream island. All those in favour of Manus please apply to Pen’s Excursions Enterprises and dear old Pen will organise your stay on Manus ASAP.

                        Commenter
                        Pen of hrba
                        Date and time
                        May 27, 2014, 3:32PM
                          • Are you cheaper than the fire sale prices now being offered by the people smugglers?

                            Commenter
                            Lewis
                            Location
                            Sydney
                            Date and time
                            May 27, 2014, 3:39PM
                          • Don't worry Pen, with all the sea level rises the Manus will be gone soon.

                            Commenter
                            Cwitty
                            Location
                            Sydney
                            Date and time
                            May 27, 2014, 3:39PM
                          • So sad that sarcasm replaces knowledge when trying to make a point. What next; will you be addressing me as petal? Amazing how not having any knowledge about something (other than what is reported - could be true, could be false), makes people such as yourself, experts. We are doomed.

                            Commenter
                            PB
                            Location
                            Sydney
                            Date and time
                            May 27, 2014, 3:44PM
                          • PB

                            I take it then that you dispute the use of barb and razor wire? That there have been no sexual abuses, and no murder. PB we are no discussing army life on Manus, we are discussing life of those held there in captivity that is the difference. What was paradise for you is now hell for others.

                            Commenter
                            Pen of hrba
                            Date and time
                            May 27, 2014, 3:53PM
                          • Cwitty

                            True, true. So be warned don't move too close to places with warmer waters or you find your self reading up on Noah.

                            Commenter
                            Pen of hrba
                            Date and time
                            May 27, 2014, 3:55PM
                          • Pen not falling for that one.
                            Your tourists may get there but will they be allowed back?
                            And the option of the (permanent) side trip to Cambodia is not on my bucket list either.

                            Commenter
                            Lyn
                            Date and time
                            May 27, 2014, 4:02PM
                          • Don't disagree at all but this is what I am saying. How do YOU know it is Hell for Others? You have never been there. Lets hear your version of what is transpiring. Facts; not something you read in the paper or heard on some tv show. Most of them haven't been there either. Facts
                            As for your term, Captivity. That assumes not being able to leave whenever they like. Is that the case or can they leave if they ask?

                            Commenter
                            PB
                            Location
                            Sydney
                            Date and time
                            May 27, 2014, 4:04PM
                          • Err, PB so you reckon the riots happened because everyone was enjoying their adventure in paradise, right?

                            Commenter
                            Pen of hrba
                            Date and time
                            May 27, 2014, 4:24PM
                          • Oh blimey. We had riots in Sydney and people got hurt. We had riots on the beaches in Sydney and people got hurt. We still have people in Sydney being shot. Just because a bunch of people do stupid things trying to get their own way or through some sense of ill-informed logic, doesn't mean the sky is falling in Sydney. The same applies up there. Disgraceful things happen in all sorts of places. Usually caused by a few people who want their own way. Doesn't mean that's how it always is.

                            Commenter
                            PB
                            Location
                            Sydney
                            Date and time
                            May 27, 2014, 4:45PM
                          • PB, there is a huge difference between what happens on the streets in Sydney, or even Kiev, and what is happening on Manus. The detainees on Manus are actually being held against their wishes in a centre and their movement around and outside the centre is physically restricted or stopped.

                            In those circumstances, the people keeping them there (which are the Australian and PNG governments have a high duty of care to ensure their safety).

                            However you look at it, there was an abysmal failure by those authorities to ensure their safety. We do know that non-participants in the riot were actually attacked and injured by the armed assailants and there is no evidence that the killed man (and he was killed while under the care of Australian authorities) was taking part in the riots. There are certainly eyewitness claims that he wasn't.

                            Commenter
                            Whyalla Wipeout
                            Date and time
                            May 27, 2014, 5:18PM
                        • Tony Bourke should be suggesting Cambodia, where Rainsey has boycotted Parliament since last July.

                          Commenter
                          A country gal
                          Date and time
                          May 27, 2014, 3:29PM
                          • The current Speaker takes leaping Leo as her model of a good Speaker? The Parliamentary Departments had better upgrade their liability insurance then.

                            Commenter
                            Whyalla Wipeout
                            Date and time
                            May 27, 2014, 3:25PM
                            • Seems what's not allowed for the goose is fine fare for the gander eh WW

                              Commenter
                              Smack
                              Location
                              City of the Fallen
                              Date and time
                              May 27, 2014, 3:56PM
                          • A senior AFP officer has said the agency did not advise Tony Abbott to avoid visit to Victorian university amid protest..

                            Another Lie???

                            Commenter
                            BANG
                            Date and time
                            May 27, 2014, 3:17PM
                            • The Government seem desperate and running out of explanations for the budget. Instead of referring to the actual policy the Prime Minister is referring to Bob Hawke. It's a bad sign when your tactic relies on a referring to a failed policy attempt of a previous Prime Minister from the other side who got ousted because of it.....

                              Commenter
                              TT
                              Location
                              Sydney
                              Date and time
                              May 27, 2014, 3:11PM
                              • this is disgraceful !
                                Waste of my money !

                                Commenter
                                LM
                                Date and time
                                May 27, 2014, 3:01PM
                                • Yes, i don't particularly enjoy paying for 60% of those uni students fees, welfare for the lazy nor the $1 billion monthly interest bill on the Labor Debt, but hey isn't that democracy for you.

                                  Commenter
                                  Hacka
                                  Location
                                  Canberra
                                  Date and time
                                  May 27, 2014, 3:26PM
                                • Yes all they do day in day out is demand the other side apologize and resign. Pathetic fools acting like spoilt school kids who cant get their own way. Nauseating.

                                  Commenter
                                  Panadol
                                  Date and time
                                  May 27, 2014, 3:28PM
                                • Hacka - the Labor Debt stopped in September and the Labor Govt did not hand $8B to the RBA - don't let the truth get in the way of a good story

                                  Commenter
                                  Bored with Phony Tony and his mates
                                  Date and time
                                  May 27, 2014, 3:31PM
                                • I'd guess LM is talking about the conduct in QT today.

                                  Commenter
                                  stevek
                                  Location
                                  Sydney
                                  Date and time
                                  May 27, 2014, 3:32PM
                                • Hakky, are you tired? that has to be one of your more bizarre off topic deflections

                                  Commenter
                                  rod steiger
                                  Location
                                  toukley
                                  Date and time
                                  May 27, 2014, 3:33PM
                                • Another deflection straight to silly point. A difficult shot to play, but Hacka is very adept.

                                  Commenter
                                  Gigondas
                                  Date and time
                                  May 27, 2014, 3:44PM
                                • Deflection ? LM's talking about wasting public money, there's a few classic examples.

                                  Add in Burke and Plibersek's performances today and i agree with LM, look at all the waste.

                                  Commenter
                                  Hacka
                                  Location
                                  Canberra
                                  Date and time
                                  May 27, 2014, 3:51PM
                                • I like that those receiving higher education degrees and qualifications under the current system end up as higher income earners and pay most of the personal exertion income tax. Why does that need fixing/changing?
                                  I like it that higher income earners under the current system end up paying back the subsidised part of their higher educations. Why does that need fixing/changing?
                                  I like it that the more highly educated the population the more productive and prosperous it is. It is estimated that 70% of the benefit of a higher education flows to society and that is how the original student contribution was determined.
                                  Sounds like a win for the individuals and a win for the country.
                                  I like that the current system strikes a balance between paying a reasonable amount for their degrees ( 40%) which strikes the balance between private and public benefit.
                                  Fortunately it appears that most Australians do not have a selfish and short sighted user pays mentality towards education that some on this forum do and do not agree with the LNP's changes as they will damage Australia's long term interests.
                                  People appear not to want a two tier system that discourages participation particularly by the less well off and in less high paying qualifications, stifles upward social mobility and entrenches privilege while transferring the burden of funding of research at Universities to the least able to pay - students and exploiting them to be the source of a wealth creation opportunity for private for profit institutions.

                                  Commenter
                                  Lyn
                                  Date and time
                                  May 27, 2014, 3:59PM
                                • I wouldn't mind paying 60% of university fees if they set a higher ATAR entrance requirement of, say, 80 and/or restricted it to the much needed diciplines. The problem here for me is that those screeching the loudest just have a high opinion of themselves, contempt for everybody else and not much else. An ATAR of 60 & a degree in basket weaving & African drumming doesn't entitle anyone anything.

                                  Commenter
                                  Lewis
                                  Location
                                  Sydney
                                  Date and time
                                  May 27, 2014, 4:18PM
                                • Hacka - I'm guessing you got you education for free - not sure that it was at a tertiary level based on your postings . .

                                  Commenter
                                  as if
                                  Date and time
                                  May 27, 2014, 5:16PM
                              • I don't get it. You would have thought that question time and all parliamentary sessions would be compulsory for all members to attend. Will some politicians get docked pay for absenteeism? Do they need a medical certificate? Perhaps there should be a co-payment required by them for their salary for non-attendance.

                                Commenter
                                Tucky
                                Location
                                Warragul
                                Date and time
                                May 27, 2014, 2:58PM
                                • I wondered yesterday when almost all the LNP members were absent, if it was procedurally possible, why Labor did not move to suspend standing orders and bring on business without notice to quickly pass a no confidence motion in the Govt and also to refer Bishop to the privileges committee?
                                  Probably not possible because surely Labor would have tried it.
                                  It would get the missing in inaction LNP back doing what they are meant to be doing and paid for and that is sitting in the chamber and listening and participating in the business of the House ,when it is in session.

                                  Commenter
                                  Lyn
                                  Date and time
                                  May 27, 2014, 3:32PM
                                • Arrgh, when is Fairfax going to fix unfinished posts disappearing into the either whenever the blog refreshes. Stop it, do you here!

                                  Commenter
                                  Pen of hrba
                                  Date and time
                                  May 27, 2014, 3:37PM
                                • Pen turn off your live button, post.Then refresh to on, aka Live.

                                  Commenter
                                  A country gal
                                  Date and time
                                  May 27, 2014, 3:44PM
                              • So Bronwyn Bishop has taken her first Government scalp. This will be very disappointing for the lefties because they would have liked it if she kept her record of 100% of Opposition member sin bins. That way they could carry on with the nonsense that the current speaker is the most biased on record while ignoring the disruptive behaviour of the opposition members. Tony Burke started the disrespect by equating the speaker to a witch and he continuously shows undue disrespect for the speaker-he and the rest of the Labor Party deserve everything that they get.

                                Commenter
                                noitall
                                Location
                                Beacon Hill
                                Date and time
                                May 27, 2014, 2:56PM
                                • funny notall - unfortunately for Dolores her die is cast - integrity-less
                                  Labor - "You don't love me,, you never bring me flowers anymore..."
                                  Flowers from Dolores..
                                  Labor - "You only did that because I asked you to ... "

                                  Commenter
                                  rod steiger
                                  Location
                                  toukley
                                  Date and time
                                  May 27, 2014, 3:14PM
                                • They must have drawn straws so the ALP couldn't keep on about the disparity in numbers of ejected MPs. He will get his reward later in the bar. Might even get an invite to Bronwyn's next fundraiser.

                                  Commenter
                                  Paul H
                                  Date and time
                                  May 27, 2014, 3:34PM
                                • Oh well that makes it balanced then.
                                  Nothing partisan to see here.
                                  Move on, move on.
                                  Was that Pyne motioning to the Speaker to eject one of their own? After all the appearance of impartiality (ejecting 1 of yours to the other sides 100) is as important as actual impartiality.

                                  Commenter
                                  Lyn
                                  Date and time
                                  May 27, 2014, 4:27PM
                              • some light afternoon reading that I cam across

                                http://theaimn.com/2014/05/25/lets-be-absolutely-crystal-clear-about-this/

                                Commenter
                                This Budget Stinks
                                Date and time
                                May 27, 2014, 2:53PM
                                • More Budget lies exposed here, complete with interactive charts of Australia compared to other countries. http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-04-23/jericho-coalition-banks-on-blind-faith-in-budget-fix/5404046

                                  Commenter
                                  mitch of ACT
                                  Date and time
                                  May 27, 2014, 3:33PM
                                • And more Lieberal lies exposed here:
                                  http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-05-06/has-the-government-doubled-the-budget-deficit/5423392
                                  http://www.abc.net.au/news/factcheck/behind-the-2014-budget/
                                  I have over a page of links to articles exposing the lies and flaws in the Budget, and that's no lie. I'm finding it very hard to find any articles by people who know what they are talking about to support the concept of a "Budget Emergency". Perhaps that's because it's like the Tooth Fairy.

                                  Commenter
                                  mitch of ACT
                                  Date and time
                                  May 27, 2014, 3:49PM
                              • After Q & A last night can we have Tara Moss as PM or at least as a benevolent dictator.

                                Commenter
                                Tucky
                                Location
                                Warragul
                                Date and time
                                May 27, 2014, 2:52PM
                                • Gawd this Parliament time is a disgrace. Is this what my taxes pay for, for a bunch of fat cats sitting opposite each other shouting at each other. Sack all of them and start again. I demand a Double Dissolution which was promised to us before the election. Common Tony, give us a DD.

                                  Commenter
                                  LM
                                  Date and time
                                  May 27, 2014, 2:52PM
                                  • Is question time worth it? Dorothy Dix gets to ask and have answered in full her questions and any from the cross benches or the Opposition get no proper answers or derided by the government and the speaker.

                                    Commenter
                                    Tucky
                                    Location
                                    Warragul
                                    Date and time
                                    May 27, 2014, 2:45PM
                                    • Is Hockey courting the KATs vote? He's sounding sensible and reasonable.

                                      Commenter
                                      A country gal
                                      Date and time
                                      May 27, 2014, 2:42PM
                                      • Bill, when will you tell your team that they are a bunch of childish twits. Most of us did far more innovative things in primary school than waving around yellow mouse-pads. Obviously these people have never employed staff in the real world.

                                        Commenter
                                        Bush Bogan
                                        Date and time
                                        May 27, 2014, 2:42PM
                                        • Plibersek tells more porkies in QT. what a useless local Member I have. Surely Shorten has to replace her.

                                          Commenter
                                          enough is enough
                                          Date and time
                                          May 27, 2014, 2:40PM
                                          • Agree. Probably got a good memory though.

                                            Commenter
                                            Bush Bogan
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 3:30PM
                                          • She is the best member any electorate could ever have. You are so lucky. She might even be PM one day.

                                            Commenter
                                            Paul H
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 3:35PM
                                        • Love the cut and paste from Cut and Paste. Andrew Leigh also advocates:

                                          • GP co-payments
                                          • Welfare reductions
                                          • Deregulated university fees

                                          Commenter
                                          Hacka
                                          Location
                                          Canberra
                                          Date and time
                                          May 27, 2014, 2:39PM
                                          • And Greg Hunt likes a carbon emissions schemes and Joe Hockey protested about the introduction of HECS and Malcolm Turnbull is a fan of FFTP.

                                            Commenter
                                            The Banker
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 3:01PM
                                          • Hacka, have you read what Andrew Leigh wrote - in context?

                                            Or do you get all your information from those lily-white never tell a lie or misrepresent the truth in any way Government Ministers?

                                            Any argument attacking the Opposition based on what a Liberal politician says has as much substance as very thin air.

                                            Commenter
                                            Whyalla Wipeout
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 5:21PM
                                        • Looks like The Opposition's QT strategy is wrong footed yet again. All based on speculation of an advertising blitz that did not eventuate.

                                          Commenter
                                          Lewis
                                          Location
                                          Sydney
                                          Date and time
                                          May 27, 2014, 2:36PM
                                          • Tony said there is no advertising campaign. We can therefore safely assume that there will be.

                                            Commenter
                                            tasch2
                                            Location
                                            Mornington Peninsula
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 2:51PM
                                        • Did the PM decide to cancel his trip to Geelong/Deakin when the PMO discovered that the chair of the company they were visiting (carbon nexus) just so happens to be a recently retired former ALP opposition member (one who didn't get to go to election as leader) ... not the sort of PR opportunity the PM and Pyne wanted ..... some lazy work from the PMO there!

                                          Commenter
                                          John
                                          Location
                                          North West MElbourne
                                          Date and time
                                          May 27, 2014, 2:24PM
                                          • NO - It was cancelled because of the threat of violence from student protesters who are demanding that less intelligent people continue to pay for their degrees.

                                            Commenter
                                            Cwitty
                                            Location
                                            Sydney
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 2:32PM
                                          • Oh Cwitty wrong again, there was AFP or anyone else. this is just another example of a run for cover government full of lies and deceit sigh

                                            Commenter
                                            Get Real
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 2:53PM
                                          • @cwitty and those "less intelligent" people will continue to pay through the nose for those degrees when those students have qualified as doctors, lawyers, medical specialists or dentists and charge sky-high professional fees to cover the exorbitant cost of their university education. It would be cheaper in the long run to give them free education. But no, market-based Lieberal ideology dictates otherwise so that only the well-heeled will be able to afford their services. Didn't the notes from your Lieberal sponsors cover the inevitable consequences of high fees for education or was your education so lacking that your brain got tired reading that far.

                                            Commenter
                                            mitch of ACT
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 2:53PM
                                          • Nice try cwitty, but the truth is that AFP did not advise Tony of any threat at any university. He is a coward and always will be one.

                                            Commenter
                                            Chris
                                            Location
                                            Perth
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 2:54PM
                                          • Cwitty,what were the actual threats? Haven't heard there were "threats".
                                            What other recent protest about higher ed funding changes has been "violent"?
                                            Your stupid, elitist comment about people of lower intelligence noted.
                                            The level of intelligence of those paying the fees, has nothing to do with students' and others' (me included) concerns about the mooted rise in fees and debt and how this can be of long term benefit to the students or Australia?
                                            Silly deflection from the basis of the concerns which is the inequity,the potential creation of a two tier system that benefits the already well off most and the reduction of the chance of social mobility that a higher education enables.
                                            It appears that the biggest beneficiaries will be the for profit private ed sector and the world ranking and therefore prestige of Universities, without any required or guarantee of improvement of outcomes for students, via improved quality of teaching and a better education, despite the expected dramatic increase in fees.

                                            Commenter
                                            Lyn
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 3:06PM
                                          • Why would he want to speak at an event where the students shout down anyone who disagrees with their view?

                                            Commenter
                                            Mick
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 3:14PM
                                          • AFP wasn't needed to determine that there was a threat of violence. The students had already acted violently towards Bishop and someone who is not even in Parliament anymore. You do not need the AFP to warn of Violence when people are throwing punches..
                                            Lynn- Intelligence is important in getting selected into university, we do not have education for all we have education for the smart kids. And the smart kids want the not so smart kids to pay for their degree so they can earn more money than the not so smart kids. The genius is the smart kids have managed to convince the not so smart tax payers that they should keeping funding professional qualifications of others. But if the not so smart kid wants to get a fork lift license. He needs to fund it himself.

                                            Commenter
                                            Cwitty
                                            Location
                                            Sydney
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 3:37PM
                                          • @Mick You mean like in Parliament?

                                            Commenter
                                            Doug
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 3:45PM
                                          • One of Julie Bishop's stares should have been enough to turn those student rabble into stone. And one lash of Sophie Mirabella's tongue should have made them candidates for an injection of anti-venene. And Tony Abbott could have stunned them with some home truths ?

                                            Commenter
                                            adam
                                            Location
                                            yarrawonga
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 4:48PM
                                          • Cwitty,
                                            there was no violence against Bishop.
                                            What are you on about? There is either a threat of violence or there isn't. Your words not mine.
                                            The AFP have stated they did not say there was a threat or advise Abbott to abandon his visit. Abbott appears to have lied again ( what's new) about that.
                                            Apparently it is necessary to support your arguments with a patent falsehood of "a threat of violence".
                                            If you think that will be swallowed, well that would make you a typical LNP'er and assuming posters on here have the wit of the sheeple who were fooled by LNP lies, I mean policy pre-election.
                                            The evidence suggests otherwise.

                                            Commenter
                                            Lyn
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 5:11PM
                                        • 1.58 "How to win friends and influence people" - not. So is this another barefaced lie. Now he'll have the AFP offside and that's not a bad thing considering they often appear partisan.
                                          Having a little visual of 'ChickenMan'.

                                          Commenter
                                          A country gal
                                          Date and time
                                          May 27, 2014, 2:21PM
                                          • another factual and enterprising post from you ACL...so original

                                            Commenter
                                            GT
                                            Location
                                            Vic
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 2:49PM
                                          • I don't think I need to cut and paste or post links to appease your lazy research. Leading story and link here. Or perhaps go back to Slippers days if you want any proof of my opinion.
                                            I can't recall a thesis or such being posted under your moniker BTW.
                                            No doubt you criticise those who post info overload.
                                            I await to read your next critical analysis.

                                            Commenter
                                            A country gal
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 3:16PM
                                        • Mousepads, how nostalgic. Maybe Labor members could wave around daisy wheeled printers next week.

                                          Commenter
                                          Hacka
                                          Location
                                          Canberra
                                          Date and time
                                          May 27, 2014, 2:21PM
                                          • Labor has found a use:

                                            Workplace Relations Minister Julia Gillard is being inundated with suggestions of what to do with the government's "plague of mousepads" designed to promote the previous government's Work Choices laws.
                                            http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/new-work-choices-for-mousepad-plague/2008/03/18/1205602370261.html

                                            Commenter
                                            stevek
                                            Location
                                            Sydney
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 2:24PM
                                          • Well steve i supposed if we're playing kiddie games, Coalition members could wave around those orange "your rights at work" T-shirts, which signaled the end of employment flexibility for small-medium sized businesses, and began the upwards surge in unemployment.

                                            Commenter
                                            Hacka
                                            Location
                                            Canberra
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 2:30PM
                                          • There's definitely something retro about the current government. Tony's attitude to women for instance (and don't let his publisher tell you otherwise!), land just about everything else.

                                            Commenter
                                            Pluto
                                            Location
                                            Melbourne
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 2:42PM
                                          • Hacka
                                            .
                                            I don't follow your line of argument.
                                            .
                                            Could you simplify it for us and perhaps metaphorically relate it to little red firetrucks please?

                                            Commenter
                                            Master Blaster
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 3:27PM
                                        • Why is Tony Abbott the Minister for Women when he has plenty of women in his government? Surely Tony Abbott could promote one the female LNP MPs to take over the Minister for Women position. But maybe he looks down on the women in his own government?

                                          Commenter
                                          Sharron
                                          Location
                                          Canberra
                                          Date and time
                                          May 27, 2014, 2:20PM
                                          • Why shouldn't he be? Are you also against female psychiatrists being allowed to counsel males? Surely it is misandrist to suggest he can't be a minister due to his gender? It's not the 1950's any more.

                                            Commenter
                                            Shaking Eagle
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 2:29PM
                                          • Surely a rhetorical question.
                                            Of course Abbott is minister for women, someone has to tell them what to think & do.

                                            Commenter
                                            Scotty
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 2:34PM
                                          • I am against a male taking the Minister for Women position when the LNP has women who should hold that position.

                                            Why do you have a problem with that? Are you against females in the ministerial positions?

                                            Commenter
                                            Sharron
                                            Location
                                            Canberra
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 2:35PM
                                          • And yes it is back to the 1950s in Tony Abbott's world. Why else would he take the Minister for Women position himself?

                                            Commenter
                                            Sharron
                                            Location
                                            Canberra
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 2:37PM
                                          • hahaha good one Scotty! : )

                                            Commenter
                                            Sharron
                                            Location
                                            Canberra
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 2:44PM
                                          • Because that all he can manage - 1 female minister

                                            Commenter
                                            Mais51
                                            Location
                                            Sydney
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 2:49PM
                                        • Well, well, well - Madam Speaker kicks one of the LNP members out to the cheers and claps of Labor.
                                          Someone must have had a word to her.

                                          Commenter
                                          maryjane
                                          Date and time
                                          May 27, 2014, 2:08PM
                                          • Jones probably volunteered to be kicked out try to offset claims of bias against Dolores.

                                            Commenter
                                            stevek
                                            Location
                                            Sydney
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 2:12PM
                                          • No I bet the coalition party meeting this morning drew up a roster.

                                            Commenter
                                            RTP
                                            Location
                                            Sawtell
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 2:14PM
                                          • Perhaps Bishop has actually considered what is expected of her. None too soon.
                                            If she didn't get the message yesterday, she never will.
                                            Let's hope it improves the mood in Parliament.
                                            Let's give her the benefit of the doubt.

                                            Commenter
                                            A country gal
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 2:16PM
                                          • They probably drew straws in the party room to see who'd have to play Captain Oates today and have to leave the tent for the good of the party.

                                            Commenter
                                            Redsaunas
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 2:19PM
                                          • Maybe Bronwyn is worried about her legacy maryjane. Didn't she want to be Prime Minister once? And look at her now. The butt of jokes. I guess that's politics.

                                            Commenter
                                            Pluto
                                            Location
                                            Melbourne
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 2:51PM
                                        • 101-1

                                          Commenter
                                          Carl
                                          Location
                                          Melbourne
                                          Date and time
                                          May 27, 2014, 2:06PM
                                          • Are they the odds of Tony retaining the leadership through to the next election?

                                            Commenter
                                            tasch2
                                            Location
                                            Mornington Peninsula
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 2:48PM
                                          • They're the odds of any question or answer during this QT informing the Australian public of anything at all.

                                            Commenter
                                            Carl
                                            Location
                                            Melbourne
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 2:54PM
                                        • Richard Marles has just explained why I, formerly a rusted-on left luvvie, refused to vote at the last election. Did not want Rudd or Abbott for PM because of their positions on the treatment of refugees and their refusal to consider the environment as a top priority. Couldn't put a sheet of tissue paper between their opinions. A plague on both their houses.

                                          Commenter
                                          MJM
                                          Date and time
                                          May 27, 2014, 2:05PM
                                          • @MJM, and that's why Clive is a shoo-in as defacto PM at the next election. He and his party will hold the balance of power in both Houses. Let's hope that he is a benevolent dictator.

                                            Commenter
                                            mitch of ACT
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 3:26PM
                                        • Browyn Bishop is condemning herself with her own words. As speaker she is a disgrace to our parliamentary system.

                                          Commenter
                                          RTP
                                          Location
                                          sawtell
                                          Date and time
                                          May 27, 2014, 2:04PM
                                          • So Abbott didn't want to move into a "sensational executive residence" in Canberra he'd rather move in to Kirribilli House" in Sydney. So around around $65,000 to cancel the lease plus $3000 a week for a couple of months, that would have been around 3 or so pensions for a year.

                                            Commenter
                                            amro
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 2:00PM
                                            • Plus all the air fares between Canberra and Sydney. John Howard started this trend - Abbott is merely a follower - hasn't got the brain power to be a leader. Just a common or garden type bully full of bluster and no ideas.

                                              Commenter
                                              MJM
                                              Date and time
                                              May 27, 2014, 2:14PM
                                            • The savings from the inevitable building and renovation delays will more than offset the $65K hit from breaking the lease. It's not rocket science.

                                              Commenter
                                              brian
                                              Date and time
                                              May 27, 2014, 2:14PM
                                          • 23, 24 million. Yes, and sorry.

                                            Commenter
                                            Pluto
                                            Location
                                            Melbourne
                                            Date and time
                                            May 27, 2014, 1:59PM
                                            • "40 to 50 budget lovers." Wow. What exactly is the population of Australia? 23, 24 thousand. Wow, Tony is definitely making inroads.

                                              Commenter
                                              Pluto
                                              Location
                                              Melbourne
                                              Date and time
                                              May 27, 2014, 1:58PM
                                              • They found 40 - 50 budget lovers? Perhaps they were lured in and bought a McHappy meal if they say nice things. Or were they actually budgie lovers and Mr. Abbott had smuggled some in.

                                                Commenter
                                                stevek
                                                Location
                                                Sydney
                                                Date and time
                                                May 27, 2014, 1:53PM
                                                • Why are we all so unkind...(snicker)

                                                  Commenter
                                                  David D
                                                  Location
                                                  Ettalong Beach
                                                  Date and time
                                                  May 27, 2014, 1:55PM
                                                • Probably the Young Libs were out on a study mission on how the other 90% live and heard Tony was in town

                                                  Commenter
                                                  Blue Tie Travels
                                                  Date and time
                                                  May 27, 2014, 2:00PM
                                              • 1.41 - the visit to Lurmeah Maccas and budget comments; we know Tony sometimes mishears and misspeaks things. Probably got *stick* right, though...

                                                Commenter
                                                David D
                                                Location
                                                Ettalong Beach
                                                Date and time
                                                May 27, 2014, 1:51PM
                                                • Family is off limits according to Shorten. It's the "big bad media kicking this around." Well the media has a right to kick things around when it looks like rules governing pollies (who are after all just ordinary citizens of this country, whose salaries we pay), are differently applied than to those applied to the populace at large. No handouts for your son or daughter mate. Let them wait six months. Pollies kids, well they're a special case and we should not talk about them because they are family of politicians, a protected species. It goes something like that Bill.

                                                  Commenter
                                                  Pluto
                                                  Location
                                                  Melbourne
                                                  Date and time
                                                  May 27, 2014, 1:43PM
                                                  • I wanta ride Uncle Clives Car

                                                    Commenter
                                                    John
                                                    Location
                                                    sydney
                                                    Date and time
                                                    May 27, 2014, 1:40PM
                                                    • Swan's new book should rightfully be titled "The Good Fight - My Ride As Seen From Sitting On The Economic Shoulders Of Howard & Costello".............

                                                      Commenter
                                                      Smack
                                                      Location
                                                      City of the Fallen
                                                      Date and time
                                                      May 27, 2014, 1:38PM
                                                      • I dare say we're going to have fun with that book title Smack, not to mention Jules' creatively titled "My Story".

                                                        Commenter
                                                        Hacka
                                                        Location
                                                        Canberra
                                                        Date and time
                                                        May 27, 2014, 1:47PM
                                                      • Recent history demonstrates that the LNP would have done nothing to counter the GFC. That is their stated policy.

                                                        As for Howard and Costello, you must be joking! Neither had the slightest grasp of macroeconomics. Both thought the government budget was the Australian economy. More like Ma and Pa Kettle.

                                                        Commenter
                                                        RichardJ
                                                        Location
                                                        Sydney
                                                        Date and time
                                                        May 27, 2014, 1:51PM
                                                      • Yeah Hacka - I'm expecting a onslaught of red rose revisionists any second now...

                                                        Commenter
                                                        Smack
                                                        Location
                                                        City of the Fallen
                                                        Date and time
                                                        May 27, 2014, 1:55PM
                                                      • It'd be way more interesting if Kev wrote "Her Story", Jules wrote "His Story", and Swannie wrote "Wayne's World".

                                                        Commenter
                                                        Hacka
                                                        Location
                                                        Canberra
                                                        Date and time
                                                        May 27, 2014, 2:05PM
                                                    • The boats were still coming until the government had the resolve to tow them back. The Turn back policy stopped the boats - Labor wouldn't even try it.

                                                      Commenter
                                                      Cwitty
                                                      Location
                                                      Sydney
                                                      Date and time
                                                      May 27, 2014, 1:00PM
                                                        • Labor didn't because it's dangerous to asylum seekers and Australian servicemen and women and a contemptuous subversion of the purposes of customs and the armed services. Operation Sovereign Borders my ass, it's Operation Saving Bacon

                                                          Commenter
                                                          rod steiger
                                                          Location
                                                          toukley
                                                          Date and time
                                                          May 27, 2014, 1:09PM
                                                        • You do realise that was Pen's declared policy long before Morrison took it up, so don't give credit where it is not due, thankyou.

                                                          "To be cost effective intercept boat, place both crew and passengers on board an Australian vessel; sink the Indonesian boat in deep water for being a danger to maritime safety. Weather permitting, if not hold both crew and passengers on a ship such as an old cruise liner stripped of luxury until weather permits crew and passengers taken to the edge of Indonesian territorial waters; place crew and passengers in inflatable boat with an outboard engine, like a zodiac, inform Indonesian authorities of location and inform them that the inflatable/s is/are a gift from Australia to Indonesia to help with inter island Indonesian travel as displayed on the inflatable’s hull/s and engine/s. Cost of inflatables born by Australian existing aid programme to Indonesia" (Pen of hrba, 2/7/13).

                                                          Commenter
                                                          Pen of hrba
                                                          Date and time
                                                          May 27, 2014, 1:12PM
                                                        • Vote [1] Pen of Hrba! *stop the gloats*

                                                          Commenter
                                                          Llama Farma
                                                          Location
                                                          Canberra
                                                          Date and time
                                                          May 27, 2014, 1:19PM
                                                        • Agreed Cwitty - how odd that Labor try to claim any credit for stopping the boats, yet deny any involvement in the militant culture that developed at Manus.

                                                          And to think the greenies want those rioters to be members of Australian society.

                                                          Commenter
                                                          Hacka
                                                          Location
                                                          Canberra
                                                          Date and time
                                                          May 27, 2014, 1:21PM
                                                        • Llama Farma

                                                          Merely yours truly trying to save lives and prevent people being sent to camps of questionable intent. No gloating simply stating the truth. But thanks for the back hander anyway.

                                                          Commenter
                                                          Pen of hrba
                                                          Date and time
                                                          May 27, 2014, 1:37PM
                                                        • they're asylum seekers hakky, however you want to demonise them

                                                          Commenter
                                                          rod steiger
                                                          Location
                                                          toukley
                                                          Date and time
                                                          May 27, 2014, 1:39PM
                                                        • Hacka

                                                          How about I dump you on Manus for a year or so to see if you get a little touchy and irritated.

                                                          Commenter
                                                          Pen of hrba
                                                          Date and time
                                                          May 27, 2014, 1:40PM
                                                        • Er, the rioting occurred on the Liberals watch. Why was that Labor's fault again? Oh, because that's the standard line whenever the Liberals can't take responsibility for their inaction.

                                                          And as for the Liberals stopping the boats, this was Labor's policy that was implemented.

                                                          It's still wrong, mind you. The whole policy is corrupt, whether it came from Labor or the usual suspects, the Liberals.

                                                          Commenter
                                                          Tone
                                                          Location
                                                          Melbourne
                                                          Date and time
                                                          May 27, 2014, 1:41PM
                                                        • @ Pen. Just a wind up. No back hander intended :)

                                                          You have to admit though, whichever side of politics you choose to lay the credit/blame to, my understanding is that they haven't had a boat arrival in some 140 odd days. The policy works. Hopefully Manus will be empty soon and the boats won't come anymore and no one will have to suffer anymore. Win-win-win.

                                                          Commenter
                                                          Llama Farma
                                                          Location
                                                          Canberra
                                                          Date and time
                                                          May 27, 2014, 1:47PM
                                                        • I don't understand. How can you tow back boats that don't come?

                                                          Still, it all depends on how many laws you want to break I guess.

                                                          Commenter
                                                          RichardJ
                                                          Location
                                                          Sydney
                                                          Date and time
                                                          May 27, 2014, 1:52PM
                                                        • The Libs can take credit for stopping the boats and increasing the number of refugees from the camps. They should also increase rather than decrease the foreign aid budget as as improve the domestic budget priorities and fairness..

                                                          Commenter
                                                          Good Logic
                                                          Date and time
                                                          May 27, 2014, 2:13PM
                                                        • Actually the boat arrivals had dropped 40% before the election under the previous governments policies.

                                                          Commenter
                                                          lance
                                                          Date and time
                                                          May 27, 2014, 2:24PM
                                                        • Hey @Pen, you do realise that Australian servicemen and their families all resided on that very same spot in Manus for quite a few years. And we did it without phones, TV, proper food, etc. You didn't hear any of us complain. Please don't espouse knowledge of a place or insult a place unless you have been/lived there. I have and for those who call it a hell hole, go there and have a look. Just the most magnificent little island (Los Negros it is called) with beautiful scenery. I have been to Pakistan, Iran, India and I am telling you, this place beats those slums hands down.

                                                          Commenter
                                                          PB
                                                          Location
                                                          Sydney
                                                          Date and time
                                                          May 27, 2014, 2:49PM
                                                      • 12.10 Jay what a coup. Hamilton-Smith and Downer had their stoushes. Downer was picked to up seat Hamilton-Smith but refused the offer.
                                                        Extraordinary development, that's called politics at play! Would like a Pyne or Bernardi comment on that one. heh, heh!

                                                        Commenter
                                                        A country gal
                                                        Date and time
                                                        May 27, 2014, 12:56PM
                                                        • And Hamilton-Smith retires at the next election with a cabinet minister's pension. Just call me cynical...

                                                          Commenter
                                                          Lewis
                                                          Location
                                                          Sydney
                                                          Date and time
                                                          May 27, 2014, 1:25PM
                                                        • I could not believe the news when I heard the stop the press announcement on ABC 891 this morning. Time other liberals with a bit of heart did the same. They might then just hold on to their seats because its going to be a landslide come 2016 (bring on the DD)

                                                          Commenter
                                                          Ausgaia
                                                          Location
                                                          Adelaide
                                                          Date and time
                                                          May 27, 2014, 1:52PM
                                                        • Lewis, I understand your cynicism but have just been over at the "other" paper and he comes across as being genuine in explaining his move. Says he will stand again and as an Indi Lib. The article also notes he's been in op yet wants to contribute. Given the mess the SA Libs have been in for years (lots of squabbles) and they basically dumped him, perhaps he's had enough. from memory I don't think he needs the $. Unusual, and no doubt Jay securing the Govt. Bob Such or the other Indi? Is really ill with brain tumour.
                                                          interesting.

                                                          Commenter
                                                          A country gal
                                                          Date and time
                                                          May 27, 2014, 2:13PM
                                                        • We'll see, ACG. Time will tell. I for one have heard too many of the political class say this & will do that with amazing sincerity and yet do the opposite.

                                                          Commenter
                                                          Lewis
                                                          Location
                                                          Sydney
                                                          Date and time
                                                          May 27, 2014, 2:25PM
                                                        • Ausgaia, spent a lot of my life in SA so keep an interest still. Was living in the hills when John Schumann nearly rolled Downer. Shame you only have the Addy to report the news.

                                                          Commenter
                                                          A country gal
                                                          Date and time
                                                          May 27, 2014, 2:27PM
                                                      • So the Australian government (i.e. taxpayers) has been paying for the PNG government's legal fees to fight the (PNG) opposition challenge to the validity of the Manus Island detention centre.

                                                        This only comes out in questioning in Senate Estimates. Scott must have forgotten to mention it… unless of course the court case is being held on a boat, in which case it would obviously be an on-water operation.

                                                        Commenter
                                                        Gigondas
                                                        Date and time
                                                        May 27, 2014, 12:54PM
                                                        • The budget apologists who seem to be having a bit of trouble getting traction here on the Pulse might like to slip over to the 2GB website for some soothing validation. I refer to the Alan Jones podcast of, and I quote, "Alan to talks to Andrew Bolt about the Abbott haters and their campaign of hypocrisy".

                                                          Should be a hoot.

                                                          Commenter
                                                          Gigondas
                                                          Date and time
                                                          May 27, 2014, 12:37PM
                                                          • And for all the debt deniers..... Christine Milne has a podcast on renewable energy.

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Cwitty
                                                            Location
                                                            Sydney
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 12:48PM
                                                          • cwitty, struggling to make the logical connection between being a 'debt denier' and wanting to know about renewable energy.

                                                            I think you may have got your briefing notes mixed up there.

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Gigondas
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 12:57PM
                                                          • Gigo simple isn't it? Debt deniers don't want to here about debt.. They are in such denial they would be much happier listening to a sermon from a popular Carbonist High Preistess

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Cwitty
                                                            Location
                                                            Sydney
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 1:05PM
                                                          • cwitty, I agree with your first assertion 100%. Your argument is certainly simple.

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Gigondas
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 1:23PM
                                                          • @Cwitty are you a product of the Lieberal education system. 2 spelling howlers "here = hear" and "preistess = priestess". Carelessness in expression destroys credibility. Your Lieberal sponsors will not be pleased.

                                                            Commenter
                                                            mitch of ACT
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 1:31PM
                                                          • Clips on ch24 showing Tony Abbott in opposition being super-critical of the Labor gov't for spending taxpayers' money to advertise the effects of the carbon tax. "If the Labor party wants to advertise the carbon tax then the Labor party should raise the funds itself" he said. So can we expect the Libs to do the same. Fat chance. Hypocrisy is alive and well.

                                                            Commenter
                                                            mitch of ACT
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 1:38PM
                                                          • Thanks Mitch. I will lift my game. but please allow for the most vulnerable in society... As public school teachers learned me how to spoke

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Cwitty
                                                            Location
                                                            Sydney
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 1:42PM
                                                        • It's ok Swan, don't worry about the sequel. Tony Abbott and Joe Hockey are writing it as a daily diary - 'Fixing the economic mess Swan left behind' Vol 1

                                                          Commenter
                                                          enough is enough
                                                          Date and time
                                                          May 27, 2014, 12:33PM
                                                          • Enough is enough, I too have had enough of this government - claiming a fake budget emergency then using disaster economics to try to attack the standard of living of Australia's poor and middle class.

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Tone
                                                            Location
                                                            Melbourne
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 12:42PM
                                                          • pretty sure they're drafting "The Economy for Dummies"

                                                            Commenter
                                                            rod steiger
                                                            Location
                                                            toukley
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 12:43PM
                                                          • At the risk of repeating myself, enough is enough, enough is enough.

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Gigondas
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 12:47PM
                                                          • Rod - highly unlikely that tome would get finished. This lot cant draft a policy - no hope for a book

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Really ?
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 1:00PM
                                                          • Surely you mean the economy by dummies!!!

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Paul
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 1:12PM
                                                          • Sorry enough is enough, about time you started educating yourself about the true state of the Australian economy, eg like consumer and business confidence is at the lowest level going.

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Ausgaia
                                                            Location
                                                            Adelaide
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 1:49PM
                                                          • So then Swan and all of us can look forward to Abbott announcing the PPL won't be going ahead, the company tax rate won't be changed and they won't be wasting tax payers money try to sell their dogs breakfast.of a budget that they don't even understand.

                                                            PS Can Hockey please stop using misleading Doctor visit numbers to try to sell his GP tax.

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Rational Thinker
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 1:52PM
                                                          • How come SMH this is the lead comment, because it is not true, Swan did not leave a mess, he left this country holding its own and the envy of the world. Liberals are ruining it and we have now become the laughing stock of the world.

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Ausgaia
                                                            Location
                                                            Adelaide
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 2:30PM
                                                        • TONE, WHAT???the 2% levy is on every penny above $180,000. What do you term upper middle class. Also, How much percentage should upper and upper middle class people pay? Seriously...These people will be paying 47% of their higher earnings. Should they pay 50%, 60% 70%. What is fair to you?

                                                          Commenter
                                                          Ethan
                                                          Location
                                                          Melbounre
                                                          Date and time
                                                          May 27, 2014, 12:22PM
                                                          • The company tax rate is around 30%. Superannuation is 15% but companies get a tax credit for tax paid. As a result, the really wealthy are paying considerably less than 47% as they leave the majority of their money in the company and get taxed at the company rate on any profits made.

                                                            The upper middle class are the ones earning over $180k. They are suckers now, but their extra tax only lasts 3 years.

                                                            After that, they get a significant relative benefit because the rest of the population will still be copping their extra expenses due to an increase in cost of services (ie Medicare co-payment) and decrease in benefits (ie family payments, pension) while the upper middle class will no longer have their extra tax.

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Tone
                                                            Location
                                                            Melbourne
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 12:40PM
                                                          • Go back to the 1984 and see what income tax they paid then - 60% cut in at $35,788 plus medicare levy not 47% @ $180,000. We have it so good - so stop complaining

                                                            https://www.ato.gov.au/Rates/Individual-income-tax-for-prior-years/?page=1#1984_85.

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Mais51
                                                            Location
                                                            Sydney
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 12:45PM
                                                          • I should add that the really wealthy don't pay much GST either. They buy everything through their companies, and GST through companies is totally claimable against GST paid. So they rarely ever pay GST. GST therefore benefits the rich at the expense of the poor and middle class. It is a drag on the economy.

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Tone
                                                            Location
                                                            Melbourne
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 12:52PM
                                                          • Tone, You are assuming that all welthy people are business owners. That is so wrong the vast majority are share holders corporate officers, managers, etc NOT owners. Also the pension just went up. it is the indexation that is changing and the age to 70 in20 years, hopefully people will put themselves in a position not to have to rely on the pension in 2035.

                                                            I do want to say though I WHOLE HEARLTY Disagree with the mediare co-payment as it is proposed. Personally I think there should be a co-payment BUT not until visit 5 or 6 at $10 and pension and concession card holders should be exempt , that will make people think about using up their FREE visits and go to the pharmacy for some cold meds. Also employers requiring doctor certificates should be billed to the companies not medicare. If the companies want to check on their employees taking sickies then they should pay for it not me. and if we eliminated the need for specialist referreals for preventative healthcare IE OBGYN's for women, and heart speacialist visits for people who need heart checks due to bypass etc, I wonder how many visits to the GP would be shaved off that 11 and how many billions would be saved.

                                                            My point is I am not all LNP, I just want people to understand the facts before passing total judgment.

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Ethan
                                                            Location
                                                            Melbourne
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 12:56PM
                                                          • Ethan there is a huge difference between people that believe they are wealthy and others that are mega-rich. I would expect many wealthy people are going to get stung for the next 3 years. It is the mega-rich, however, that are getting off scot-free. They even own shares via their companies. They are about to get a (company) tax cut, not a tax increase, courtesy of this government.

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Tone
                                                            Location
                                                            Melbourne
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 1:12PM
                                                          • WOW Tone, so let me understand. You are actually vilifying the LNP for not taking what you think is appropriate action against 1/10 or 1% of the populations or like 100 people???

                                                            That is Labuor in a nutshell...

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Ethan
                                                            Location
                                                            Melbourne
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 1:33PM
                                                          • Yes Ethan, everyone should pay. The fact that you are ok with the 1% not paying makes it look like you are paid for your comment.

                                                            It's interesting that people can be so supportive of their football team that they are happy to pay their dues, even though the elite aren't paying their fair share.

                                                            You need to read a book called Freakonomics. There is a chapter there on how the drug dealers actually got people to pay memberships to become gang members, even though they were rarely the beneficiaries. It's a pyramid scheme and it looks like you are the sucker at the bottom.

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Tone
                                                            Location
                                                            Melbourne
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 1:47PM
                                                          • Tone - My God - So many totally untrue assertions about the use of company's income tax-wise and GST-wise that it's hard to know where to start in addressing your ignorance in 300 words or less.

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Smack
                                                            Location
                                                            City of the Fallen
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 1:53PM
                                                          • Smack, please feel free to start any time you like. I don't think you can - everything I have said is true.

                                                            I very much doubt, given your comment, that you have a finance degree, and you're speaking to someone that actually owns a company.

                                                            I operate it all legitimately, of course. All my expenses are for legitimate business reasons. When you own a huge multinational, you have so many business interests that all your expenses can become legitimate.

                                                            As for the GST, any invoice I raise attracts GST that the customer must pay. When I buy something, I can essentially subtract the GST associated with my purchase from GST that I am withholding on behalf of my customer.

                                                            The result is that I don't have to pay GST on my purchase. But it must be for a legitimate business purpose.

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Tone
                                                            Location
                                                            Melbourne
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 3:28PM
                                                          • Actually, Tone, I have 2 degrees in accounting/finance/tax and a graduate diploma to boot & have worked in the tax area all my adult life & let me tell you that your earlier comment was dead motherless wrong. Luckily you went some way to redeeming yourself in your last comment

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Smack
                                                            Location
                                                            City of the Fallen
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 5:24PM
                                                        • Mais51, I agree but you are wrong as are so many people when it cmes to what was promised. Go back and watch the debates again. What the LNP promised was no cuts to health and education. What is funded now will be funded under the LNP. Any changes would be taken to the next election. Now look at the changes
                                                          Gonski is fully funded this term. the funding cuts are to the next election
                                                          Health. Is fully funded. the cuts in funding are after the next election
                                                          the penision age rises in 20 years

                                                          Now granted the LNP have broken their tax promises in relation to the fuel excise and 2% increase on the wealthy BUT the no Cuts to health or education THIS TERM is being kept.

                                                          Also, in regards to the budget honesty. ?Year 5 was not apart of the documents and that is were Swann hid everything.

                                                          Commenter
                                                          Ethan
                                                          Location
                                                          Melbounre
                                                          Date and time
                                                          May 27, 2014, 12:18PM
                                                          • Ethan, you are being dishonest here. The health and education budgets are being cut to the tune of $20Billion. The fact that they flicked the cut to the states to introduce is deceitful and politically motivated and doesn't alter the fact that there is $20billion less funding unless the states cut something else.

                                                            I believe you have fallen for the LNP spin machine.

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Lance
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 12:45PM
                                                          • Sorry Ethan - we agree to disagree. Thanks for your comment

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Mais51
                                                            Location
                                                            Sydney
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 12:47PM
                                                          • Maise, the 20B cuts are next term. You are the one MISLEADING THE PUBLIC AND YOURSELF..

                                                            YES we agree to disagree, Thank you for joining in the debate.

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Ethan
                                                            Location
                                                            Melbourne
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 1:00PM
                                                          • Lance please tell us how an education budget of $14 billion this budget and an education budget of 18 billion 17/18 is a $20 Million cut?

                                                            Were you apprenticed to Wayne Swan???

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Andie
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 1:09PM
                                                        • 12.05 Swans book, should be an interesting read.
                                                          One I have already ordered though is Rob Oakshott's "Independent for Lyne" due out on the 1st. Allen and Unwin.
                                                          Do miss him and Windsor- integrity.

                                                          Commenter
                                                          A country gal
                                                          Date and time
                                                          May 27, 2014, 12:14PM
                                                          • Integrity? That's a good one. Betrayed their conservative electorates through a personal dislike of Abbott, stuck with the ALP as it lurched from one unmitigated policy disaster to the next and then had to bow out or be decimated at the 2013 election for their self serving, pathetic behaviour. Integrity? Good grief. Where are these shining bastions now ACG?. Why didn't their integrity stand them in excellent stead to challenge for another term in parliament? Certainly they knew they stood no chance in their own electorates and that really is the acid test, isn't it ACG?

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Traddles
                                                            Location
                                                            Geelong
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 1:03PM
                                                          • Betrayed? Did you take note of what they achieved for rural Oz. I was initially surprised by Windsor's resignation but given that he was up against a huge concerted campaign by Joyce, not surprised. Besides he's given a lot of his life for his electorate, State and Fed. He's a beacon of integrity, selfless. Then also helped get McGowan in. Sadly, she's a bit lost in the current rabble. I get the impression Oakshott quit after Windsor did (because he did) Writing was on the wall with Aboat and he obviously has better things to do, namely his four very young kids. Both those two still retained their conservative sides, they left when the party swung further to the right.
                                                            I'm all for more Indi's.
                                                            I'm looking forward to the read.

                                                            Commenter
                                                            A country gal
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 1:31PM
                                                          • Hope you read today's installment of the chapter where he expresses his regret of joining the Gillard alliance because of their deplorable handling of the Indigenous affairs.

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Andie
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 1:38PM
                                                        • 10.28 am Why does Senator Michaelia Cash always look like she is about to peck somebody?

                                                          Commenter
                                                          David D
                                                          Location
                                                          Ettalong Beach
                                                          Date and time
                                                          May 27, 2014, 12:13PM
                                                          • LOL! Check out the one at 1:05pm!

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Lewis
                                                            Location
                                                            Sydney
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 1:17PM
                                                          • Check out the photo at 1.05pm - watch out!

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Sarah
                                                            Location
                                                            Melbourne
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 1:22PM
                                                          • Misogyny alert!

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Andie
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 1:48PM
                                                        • 11.14; of course Mumbles Abbott didnt lug the mangle and the laundryboiler down the dusty North Shore track to the harbour holiday home, Eric. He listened to Stumbles Hockey and got the rest of the country to be lifters....

                                                          Commenter
                                                          David D
                                                          Location
                                                          Ettalong Beach
                                                          Date and time
                                                          May 27, 2014, 12:04PM
                                                          • Labors inability to govern responsibly and ensure the continuous prosperity of its people has caused the Liberals to act decisively and swiftly,and now Labor will endeavour to block most of their budget measures through the senate.This is political bastardry at its best.Bill Shorten and his cronies represent a huge danger to Australia and its way of life, and the only thing they will achieve by using scare tactics and trying to pull the wool over peoples eyes is prolonged unnecessary economic and financial pain and suffering to the people of Australia.

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Garry of Melbourne
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 11:51AM
                                                            • No, political bastardry is what the Liberals have done to the Australian people. Lie about everything to get into power, claim a non-existent budget emergency, then implement unnecessarily aggressive measures that drop the standard of living for 90% of the population, while having very little effect on the top 10%.

                                                              Commenter
                                                              Tone
                                                              Location
                                                              Melbourne
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 12:01PM
                                                            • The LNP apologist's cries appear to be growing shriller daily. Perhaps Labor (and most other non-government senators) is blocking the budget because it is so wrong.

                                                              Commenter
                                                              stevek
                                                              Location
                                                              Sydney
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 12:02PM
                                                            • Tone, show me any credible evidence of a drop in standard of living for 90% of the population.

                                                              Commenter
                                                              Jack Black
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 12:08PM
                                                            • Jack Black, all the modelling from the budget shows a drop for the general population of about 10% of their income.

                                                              That indicates to me, well, to anyone really, that there is to be a drop in standard of living.

                                                              On top of this, the GST is going to be increased as a direct result of the removal of $80 billion dollars from State governments. Hockey has said that for the States to continue to fund their hospitals etc, they will need to ask for an increase of at least 3% or 4%. No one increases their GST by 3% or 4%, so the increase is most likely to be 5%.

                                                              So the general population will have a standard of living drop of about 15%.

                                                              Thanks for asking.

                                                              Commenter
                                                              Tone
                                                              Location
                                                              Melbourne
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 12:23PM
                                                            • Swing and a miss, Tone. Fail on maths but an A+ on fortune-telling.

                                                              "Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak and remove all doubt."

                                                              Commenter
                                                              Jack Black
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 12:37PM
                                                            • @Jack Black - You have used a very nice bit of trickery here haven't you. You have done what the government is trying to do - put the blame on the innocent party so that others don't look at you. It is up to you to present how a reduction of welfare spending does not impact anyone. You must have the golden goose that lays golden eggs as in basic financials if you are getting $100 and someone takes it away they have $100 less. How is that not an impact.

                                                              The old adage should apply here - put up or shut up. How about you look at this article for one of many examples:

                                                              http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/women-to-be-hit-hardest-by-student-loan-debt-20140526-38znv.html

                                                              Commenter
                                                              Lance
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 12:50PM
                                                            • Jack Black, that's hilarious. But I should point out two things.

                                                              Firstly, when someone can't win an argument, they often resort to name calling.

                                                              Secondly, I couldn't care less about your name calling.

                                                              Why do you feel the need to support views you know are wrong? Keep believing your loyalty will be rewarded, somehow, someday.

                                                              Personally, I think it says a lot more about you than me.

                                                              Commenter
                                                              Tone
                                                              Location
                                                              Melbourne
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 12:57PM
                                                            • Lance, steady on there, Turbo - I'm not the one making outrageous claims. I note that you've done nothing to support Tone's claim of the 'general population' losing 10% of their income and the part about GST will go to the next election. All I asked for was a credible source and sorry, Tone's primary school-standard "research" doesn't cut it.

                                                              Over to you, red leader.

                                                              Commenter
                                                              Jack Black
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 1:08PM
                                                            • Nice try Jack, but you still fail to explain how taxing the majority of Australians isn't going to cause a drop in the standard of living.

                                                              The money is removed from the economy. People, especially poor people, have less to live on. Some will even become desperate and may commit crimes just to survive. How does that not equate to a drop in the standard of living?

                                                              Commenter
                                                              Tone
                                                              Location
                                                              Melbourne
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 1:31PM
                                                          • Cwitty

                                                            I know this is of topic but it is important to understand what Abbott is doing. So In answer to your witty on sea rise that isn't, in 2010 it was reported that New Moore Island, which is about two miles long and 1.5 miles wide that Bangladesh referred to as South Talpatti has been completely submerged, said oceanographer Sugata Hazra, a professor at Jadavpur University in Kolkata. Its disappearance has been confirmed by satellite imagery and sea patrols, he said.
                                                            Scientists at the school of oceanographic studies at the university have noted an alarming increase in the rate at which sea levels have risen over the past decade in the Bay of Bengal.
                                                            Until 2000, the sea levels rose about 3mm (0.12 inches) a year, but over the last decade they have been rising about 5mm annually, he said. Another nearby island, Lohachara, was submerged in 1996, forcing its inhabitants to move to the mainland, while almost half the land of Ghoramara island was underwater, he said. At least 10 other islands in the area were also at risk, Hazra added.

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Pen of hrba
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 11:47AM
                                                            • Another classic cut and paste job. Wow, pen, you're so smart...

                                                              Commenter
                                                              Jack Black
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 12:10PM
                                                            • The smarts come by understanding what to cite by having the knowledge of what has been written in the past, as any university student will tell you. It is called learning.

                                                              Commenter
                                                              Pen of hrba
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 12:25PM
                                                            • Pen - my passionate carbonist friend. If the sea has been rising as you claim you wouldn’t need to pass off examples of coastal erosion and the natural submergence of islands as a sea level rise. You should be able to point to at least one bridge anywhere in the world that is closer to the ocean now then the day it was built. It’s called the clearance level and is measured closely for every Bridge that spans tidal waters. The Brooklyn Bridge was built in 1880. At 5mm a year for 134 years the bridge should be about 67 cm (40 cm @ 3 mm/year) closer to the water today then on the day it was built. Bridge clearance levels are the perfect indicator because unlike wooden tide markers they are built on foundations that do not suffer from subsidence. It should be easy to prove, if it is really happening. But you cannot prove it with an empirical measure because it is not happening – Every bridge ever built is exactly the same distance to the water as the day they were built.

                                                              Commenter
                                                              Cwitty
                                                              Location
                                                              Sydney
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 12:31PM
                                                            • Pen

                                                              There are other factors at play as well as rising sea levels. Fresh water flows, land compaction and not to mention 160 million living in a space that would occupy two-thirds of Victoria. It's also a delta flood plain that would be highly sensitive to its environs. Irrespective of the cause, Bangladesh is always a disaster in waiting

                                                              Commenter
                                                              $keptic
                                                              Location
                                                              Melbourne
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 12:41PM
                                                            • Here you go Ctwitty - 2009 - National Science and Technology Council, the U.S. Climate Change Science Program
                                                              Coastal Sensitivity to Sea-Level Rise: A Focus on the Mid-Atlantic Region.

                                                              "One impact of sea-level rise not generally mentioned is the decreased clearance under bridges. Even with precise timing of the stage of tide and passage under fixed bridges, sea-level rise will affect the number of low water windows available for the large vessels now being built. Bridge clearance has already become an operational issue for major ports, as evidenced by the installation of real-time reporting air gap/bridge clearance sensors in the NOAA Physical Oceanographic Real-Time System (PORTS) (NOAA, 2005)."

                                                              Commenter
                                                              rod steiger
                                                              Location
                                                              toukley
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 1:06PM
                                                            • Well I guess Cwitty and Skeptic just know more than all the climate scientists in the world who've spent decades researching this.

                                                              Commenter
                                                              JLD
                                                              Location
                                                              Melbourne
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 1:07PM
                                                            • @Jack Black: Information about on the internet if you care to search for it - or your climate skeptic attitude pulls wool over your eyes. It only takes a few minutes of googling. I dare you try it.

                                                              Commenter
                                                              Mais51
                                                              Location
                                                              Sydney
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 1:36PM
                                                            • Rod, This report like others mentions problems out of context. The reason these sensors are being used is because ships being built today are larger and taller than ever before therefore in some ports where the stationary bridge is low they have to have exact clearance level data as to when these taller ships can pass under the bridge during a low tide. I hate to tell you this but the rising sea levels are due to season ice melts and last year Greenland had more ice than the last 100 years. the earth has be warming every year for thousands of years before the industrial revolution began I think it was ummmm oh yea the end of the last ice age. The fact is all the conjuncture about global warming is misleading in that the earth is always \warming. The questions is at what rate and how much does human impact that rate?

                                                              Commenter
                                                              Ethan
                                                              Location
                                                              Melbourne
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 1:43PM
                                                            • JLD

                                                              A silly comment indeed, given I alluded to global warming playing its part. The question may be asked, is Bangladesh sinking or being inundated by rising sea levels? Tuvalu springs to mind, but then I guess you are shy on reading up on the topic.

                                                              Commenter
                                                              $keptic
                                                              Location
                                                              Melbourne
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 3:02PM
                                                            • Gee ether, I don't know what qualifications you have, but here's NASA's GRACE Mission's view this year on global ice loss
                                                              "What these measurements show is that ice mass loss from both Greenland and Antarctica are accelerating, but the data for the time period is still too short to determine whether ice sheet mass loss will follow a somewhat linear path, or an exponential path doubling every 10 years or shorter time period."
                                                              NASA's only doubt is whether the loss will contune to be bad or become exponentially worse .
                                                              - denialists are 21st century luddites -

                                                              Commenter
                                                              rod steiger
                                                              Location
                                                              toukley
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 3:09PM
                                                            • Rod - I know the theory. I am looking for the evidence. So name a bridge, any bridge that has suffered from a reduced clearance *crickets*

                                                              Commenter
                                                              Cwitty
                                                              Location
                                                              Sydney
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 3:51PM
                                                            • ctwitty, you do indeed have a fascination with bridges as evidentiary tools - However, the research seeks empirical evidence of ice melt and sea level rise, and risk management strategies to mitigate that rise. Hence reports such as those from the European Commission "scientific conclusions about future consequences from climate changes (Sea level rise, tropical and extra-tropical cyclones and sea storm risks, wave climates, heat waves, heavy precipitation) which should be considered in view of risk assessment for sea ports."
                                                              or the Californian Natural Resources Agency "Over the past century, sea level has risen nearly eight inches along the California coast, and general circulation model scenarios suggest very substantial increases in sea level as a significant impact of climate change over the coming century." If you want to wait until your bridges do a canary in the coalmine, I suggest we'll be too late. The mine will be full of gas.

                                                              Commenter
                                                              rod steiger
                                                              Location
                                                              toukley
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 4:23PM
                                                          • In the set of photos behind Warren Snowdon in the Labor Party Room, how come Kevin Rudd only has one photo? Shouldn't he have two (either side of Julia)?

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Helihound
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 11:43AM
                                                            • One Rudd is more than enough for any sane person, thank you very much.

                                                              Commenter
                                                              Pen of hrba
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 11:50AM
                                                            • So by that theory, you'd like two each of Menzies and Fisher and three of Deakin.

                                                              Commenter
                                                              A country gal
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 11:50AM
                                                            • There should also be thirteen empty frames to symbolise the faceless men of the ALP.

                                                              Commenter
                                                              Nulla
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 11:53AM
                                                            • Not sure that the ALP would post photos of Menzies or Deakin in the party room. Fischer of course.

                                                              Commenter
                                                              Helihound
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 1:56PM
                                                          • I'd love somebody to transcribe what Bronwyn Bishop is saying to the Opposition towards the end of the vote n this video. I presume microphones were accidentally left on....
                                                            http://media.brisbanetimes.com.au/news/federal-politics/labor-targets-bronwyn-bishop-5458008.html

                                                            Commenter
                                                            Simon
                                                            Location
                                                            Brisbane
                                                            Date and time
                                                            May 27, 2014, 11:36AM
                                                            • Aren't the ALP supposed to have a spring in their step this week ?

                                                              Looking at the 10:39 party room photo, you'd reckon they're listening to their GP delivering some bad news, and being charged a $7 co-payment for the privilege.

                                                              Commenter
                                                              Hacka
                                                              Location
                                                              Canberra
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 11:33AM
                                                              • Oh, Hacka, at least you're more consistent than the government! The serious faces are because the government has seriously stuffed everything up - from the budget, to decency, to truth and to consistence - and the Opposition have lots to be serious about to prevent the country going into an unnecessary economy downturn. They spend while telling others to save. They use public resources for their own benefit. This is a real mob of dopes who are trying to trick the Australian public - and (thankfully) failing.

                                                                Commenter
                                                                Prose
                                                                Location
                                                                Sydey
                                                                Date and time
                                                                May 27, 2014, 11:59AM
                                                              • Who would be happy with the impact of this Budget ? Smoking Joe was smiling at the time - but perhaps ALP Members better understand and thus reflect what a shocker it is

                                                                Commenter
                                                                This Budget Stinks
                                                                Date and time
                                                                May 27, 2014, 12:01PM
                                                              • Many rational economists are happy that the budget is a good start at least, but needs to do more.

                                                                Oh, and look over there - Wayne Swan has popped up again to remind us who delivered the budget and debt disaster in the first place.

                                                                The Good Fight huh - does the first chapter contain those immortal words: "the four surpluses i announce tonight ...." ?

                                                                Commenter
                                                                Hacka
                                                                Location
                                                                Canberra
                                                                Date and time
                                                                May 27, 2014, 12:13PM
                                                              • Yes Hacka - the Budget did need to do more - lets start with changes to FBT, Family Trusts, Super concessions, tax avoidance etc. Most economists would have an expectation that the focus also be on the revenue side of the equation.

                                                                Commenter
                                                                Blue Tie ineptitude
                                                                Date and time
                                                                May 27, 2014, 12:48PM
                                                              • Not true BTI - revenue as a share of GDP is the highest it's been since 2008-09, so i'm not sure what you're complaining about.

                                                                The problem has always been the Swan spending addiction.

                                                                Don't you love the title of the book - given we didn't get anywhere near an even small recession for many reasons, including the Howard factor, does Swan think we all suffer from amnesia ?

                                                                Predicted print run: about 10.

                                                                Commenter
                                                                Hacka
                                                                Location
                                                                Canberra
                                                                Date and time
                                                                May 27, 2014, 1:05PM
                                                              • Hacka - hmm - perhaps my point is that the "heavy lifting" is skewed. Remove some of the rorts and mates rates and there would be more money to spend . . hmm

                                                                Commenter
                                                                Blue Tie ineptitude
                                                                Date and time
                                                                May 27, 2014, 1:33PM
                                                              • Back onto the inequitable budget line BTI ?

                                                                Well i agree that the government needs to do more to dispel the myths that Bill is peddling about $80 billion sledgehammer hits to the states, $30 billion in education finding that's evaporated, and the pork-barrel-gold suggestion that the wealth aren't carrying a burden.

                                                                As for NATSEM numbers Bill's trying to use, they were based on false assumptions.

                                                                What are your numbers telling you about budget equity - or asked differently, can you demonstrate that the more wealthy aren't paying their share ?

                                                                Commenter
                                                                Hacka
                                                                Location
                                                                Canberra
                                                                Date and time
                                                                May 27, 2014, 1:46PM
                                                              • Hacka - yes - the easy ride that allows anyone to minimise tax through "top end of town freebies and other such entitlements" helps them shirk taxes that would otherwise be payed. The Budget needs to look at these measures

                                                                Commenter
                                                                Blue Tie ineptitude
                                                                Date and time
                                                                May 27, 2014, 1:57PM
                                                              • BTI - rightly or wrongly, many of those measures have been in place for years, yet it sounds like you're trying to pin them on Hockey.

                                                                Commenter
                                                                Hacka
                                                                Location
                                                                Canberra
                                                                Date and time
                                                                May 27, 2014, 2:09PM
                                                            • Before Senator Cormann starts wasting hundreds of millions of dollars on a propaganda campaign to prob up his miserable budget, perhaps he should have the campaign funded out of LNP funds instead,give the taxpayer a break for once. Afterall, if he deficit is so bad as he says, why is he adding to it with a ridiculous advertising campaign to sell a damp squib of a budget ?

                                                              Commenter
                                                              Piesnchess
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 11:14AM
                                                              • No, let the Libs waste more cash. More ammunition for Labor to attack them. Shows just how out of touch the Libs are. Spending $millions to convince families that taking a big cut to their incomes is to be eagerly awaited. Sounds like a sketch from the Gruen Transfer.

                                                                Commenter
                                                                mitch of ACT
                                                                Date and time
                                                                May 27, 2014, 11:36AM
                                                              • Why should taxpayers be funding LNP's advertising of the dead dog budget? Isn't that just electioneering? I would have thought they would have to pass it first before being allowed to waste taxpayers money on trying to sell it to us. Also, they say we have a budget emergency (not) but then want to use millions of our money for advertising it. Hypocrites and liars.

                                                                Commenter
                                                                marg1
                                                                Location
                                                                orange
                                                                Date and time
                                                                May 27, 2014, 12:06PM
                                                              • And how much money do you think the ALP spent on Tony Blair's propaganda Minister? you know, the one who sucked you all in on the Mr No campaign? Obviously it was too hard for the ALP to come up with on their own.

                                                                Commenter
                                                                Shaking Eagle
                                                                Date and time
                                                                May 27, 2014, 12:15PM
                                                            • The pictures on the wall says it all: the drovers dog who lost; the dismissal toff who wasn’t so swell, then there is watch my lips whose mouth disappeared faster than tax relief, the bird of prey who turned out to be a turtle dove; the hand crusher who crushed his own chances; the mock Chamberlain who also could not achieve peace, the egomaniac; the storyteller, and the one who is too short for the job.

                                                              Commenter
                                                              Pen of hrba
                                                              Date and time
                                                              May 27, 2014, 11:12AM
                                                              • The Govt or at least the Nats are in obvious damage control. Note, my local MP for Mallee is holding a couple of PR sessions locally here in Cafe's. A busy week for him, Parliament then in the south of his electorate (Mallee is a large electorate). Seems odd he'd pick this week and heading to Dimboola? A small but strong Labor stronghold. Now what to raise with him, the list is endless. I don't know where to begin.
                                                                Any suggestions?

                                                                Commenter
                                                                A country gal
                                                                Date and time
                                                                May 27, 2014, 11:05AM
                                                                • Perhaps a DD date ?

                                                                  Commenter
                                                                  Really ?
                                                                  Date and time
                                                                  May 27, 2014, 11:17AM
                                                                • Really- TA, I'll put it on my (bucket) list.

                                                                  Commenter
                                                                  A country gal
                                                                  Date and time
                                                                  May 27, 2014, 11:22AM
                                                                • ACG yes how about leaving us old folks alone this working to 70 is rubbish, they forget the older folks do all the volunteering take that away and they would be up for millions. Leave the carbon tax and up the MRRT.

                                                                  Commenter
                                                                  amro
                                                                  Date and time
                                                                  May 27, 2014, 11:24AM
                                                                • Hi Gal, thanks for the question. Suggest it is time for Labor policy to treat asylum seekers humanely (on shore), and rebuild Australia's international reputation.

                                                                  Commenter
                                                                  Joe Pierre
                                                                  Location
                                                                  Orange
                                                                  Date and time
                                                                  May 27, 2014, 11:34AM
                                                                • Amro, I expect they'll be plenty of OAPs chewing his ear. Plenty of retirees in Dimi and fair dinkum (to quote the PMs new fav word) a few quite feisty. Old school Labor, who are not happy with new Labor either.
                                                                  P.S He's just been on RN again, gets plenty of exposure on here with Breaking Politics- even though he's a first termer wouldn't be surprised if he's going to give Barnaby a run for his money. Might ask him that too.

                                                                  Commenter
                                                                  A country gal
                                                                  Date and time
                                                                  May 27, 2014, 11:36AM
                                                                • Ask him to ask Labor what they propose as an alternative to fix the mess that they left behind when they were kicked out last September.

                                                                  Commenter
                                                                  Bush Bogan
                                                                  Date and time
                                                                  May 27, 2014, 11:45AM
                                                                • Jon Pierre, To his credit he has been a bit sympathetic to the refugee cause, in word at least. So was his predecessor John Forrest. He has expressed concern over the draconian and cruel treatment. Quite a few "boat people" in Nth Mallee and we also have a lot of Karens. Success stories too.
                                                                  Definitely will raise, was on my list.

                                                                  Commenter
                                                                  A country gal
                                                                  Date and time
                                                                  May 27, 2014, 11:57AM
                                                                • Bush Bogan, I will be asking him why $500M has been ripped from Landcare and supposedly re pumped into the dud DA. Mallee is the grain bowl of Vic and also home to many Rare and Threatened Flora/Fauna. We are under climate threat from inaction, land degradation and salinity.
                                                                  The MDBP is also under threat, Windsor worked long and hard to help get that balance right.
                                                                  P.S you sound very much like EiE.

                                                                  Commenter
                                                                  A country gal
                                                                  Date and time
                                                                  May 27, 2014, 12:05PM
                                                                • ACG - Mallee - 17.5% primary vote for Labor at the 2013 election. 2PP for Labor 26.34% last election. Sounds like you would be up against it a bit pushing your Labor/Green views in your part of the world.

                                                                  Commenter
                                                                  Bush Bogan
                                                                  Date and time
                                                                  May 27, 2014, 12:44PM
                                                                • BB until the 2013 election campaign when the Libs threw in $1M (equal to Joyces) we had the unenviable title as the least marginal seat in the country. That $1M by the Libs still a sour taste for Nats- tainted the romance.
                                                                  All the more reason to push a bit. The margin is not healthy, no matter what party holds the seat.
                                                                  But Dimi, is an unusual Labor spot (Railway Hub) as is Natimuk (rock climbers, enviro) for The Greens.
                                                                  Hence it's interesting Broad is visiting so soon after the Budget and after a busy week.
                                                                  Big things are expected of Broad hence his comfy seat being gifted to him after Forrest's retirement (Used to get on pretty well with John, did me a few favours whilst in business).
                                                                  Same with Lib, Tehan in neighbouring Wannon (ex Mal Fraser).
                                                                  # Note how many Dixers Tehan gets to ask. He's mooted to be a rising star?
                                                                  # Watch both of them.

                                                                  Commenter
                                                                  A country gal
                                                                  Date and time
                                                                  May 27, 2014, 1:14PM
                                                                • ACG Gee I used to live in you're electorate went to Swan Hill high school way back in 1956 those were the days.

                                                                  Commenter
                                                                  amro
                                                                  Date and time
                                                                  May 27, 2014, 1:29PM
                                                              • "Who ordered a tall glass of Pacific Island coastal erosion dressed up as sea level rises?"

                                                                Commenter
                                                                Cwitty
                                                                Location
                                                                Sydney
                                                                Date and time
                                                                May 27, 2014, 11:04AM
                                                                • Not to worry I have sent the islanders a water gauge each to check global sea rise. I enclosed a note with your advise that warming water does not expand.

                                                                  Commenter
                                                                  Pen of hrba
                                                                  Date and time
                                                                  May 27, 2014, 11:15AM
                                                                • The glass wasn't ordered, but it has been delivered via CC. Some of our first CC refugees are from Islands off Bougainville and in the Pacific. They are extremely vulnerable to sea water affecting their subsistence agriculture practices.
                                                                  # Noted is the absence of Sing Sing dancers- the childish Smirk that Alex captured in the PM's PNG tour for all to see, that was yet again another classic example of his cultural ineptitude and insensitivity.

                                                                  Commenter
                                                                  A country gal
                                                                  Date and time
                                                                  May 27, 2014, 11:19AM
                                                                • I hope they sailed here.

                                                                  Commenter
                                                                  brian
                                                                  Date and time
                                                                  May 27, 2014, 11:28AM
                                                                • *DIng *Ding
                                                                  "Order Up! Coastal erosion."
                                                                  Bugger!
                                                                  "These kids have done a runner and refuse to pay for their Glass of coastal erosion"

                                                                  The one positive about the Carbonists is that according to the cult coastal erosion is no longer occurring. It is all caused by 'localised' sea level rises. You know it makes sense!!

                                                                  Commenter
                                                                  Cwitty
                                                                  Location
                                                                  Sydney
                                                                  Date and time
                                                                  May 27, 2014, 11:32AM
                                                                • Localised sea rise? You are actually referring to the fact that existing warm waters are warming faster than cooler waters, thus water expansion of warmer waters is significantly more than in cooler waters, hence faster sea rise. I believe that I have been telling you this for some time.

                                                                  Commenter
                                                                  Pen of hrba
                                                                  Date and time
                                                                  May 27, 2014, 12:21PM
                                                              • Photo at 10:42am. Is it just me or is that gallery wall of Labor leaders running out of space? Maybe that's why they agreed to making it more difficult to knife incumbent leaders...

                                                                Commenter
                                                                Lewis
                                                                Location
                                                                Sydney
                                                                Date and time
                                                                May 27, 2014, 10:59AM
                                                                • Well, the PBO has come out and supported Abbott and Co. in regards to the LNP claims of a budget emergency as has senior economists. Also I can't seem to grasp why the ALP won't py up and take responsibility for THEIR MESS, all Shorten is, is a NO man. He can't even deliver the ALP's policy and budget measures, oh wait they don't have any

                                                                  Commenter
                                                                  Ethan
                                                                  Location
                                                                  Melbourne
                                                                  Date and time
                                                                  May 27, 2014, 10:51AM
                                                                  • Ethan just a gentle reminder: Abbott and co had six years to come up with a policy and they didn't, they had to ask a bunch of business people to tell them what to do via their Commission of Audit. This budget is the direct result of the COA report. For your information Bill Shorten may do the same when next in government.

                                                                    Commenter
                                                                    Mais51
                                                                    Location
                                                                    Sydney
                                                                    Date and time
                                                                    May 27, 2014, 11:04AM
                                                                  • Source ?

                                                                    Commenter
                                                                    mitch of ACT
                                                                    Date and time
                                                                    May 27, 2014, 11:05AM
                                                                  • Oh yes, and Dr No tony abbott had no polices prior to the election did he, aside from 3 word bogan slogans. Strange how you LNP guys forget their lack of policies, and the promises they did make turned out to be a mess of lies and deceit.

                                                                    Commenter
                                                                    Piesnchess
                                                                    Date and time
                                                                    May 27, 2014, 11:11AM
                                                                  • Mais51, Absolutley this budget is in line with the COA and yes business experts gave advice on how to fix the economy. Good leaders are defined by those around him and the advice the take. the ALP's policy advice was during the rudd/Gillard/rudd years came from where?

                                                                    Mitch. My source was SKY NEWS, CNN, and the news papers. have a gander.

                                                                    Commenter
                                                                    Ethan
                                                                    Location
                                                                    Melbourne
                                                                    Date and time
                                                                    May 27, 2014, 11:16AM
                                                                  • Hi Mitch - it is time for you to stop being a Debt denier!!
                                                                    Phil Bowen from the PBO was interviewed by Fairfax media When asked if the budget was built on a manufacture crisis he replied
                                                                    "I don't agree with that. If you just continued on the trajectory of payments and revenues prior to the budget, net debt is forecast to grow rapidly. I think, at the highest rate in the OECD"

                                                                    Front page AFR 27/5/14

                                                                    Commenter
                                                                    Cwitty
                                                                    Location
                                                                    Sydney
                                                                    Date and time
                                                                    May 27, 2014, 11:17AM
                                                                  • Piesnchess, the CORE policies were and still are to
                                                                    1.Fix the budget and economy: Trying to be done
                                                                    2.Stop the boats: ACHIEVED
                                                                    3. Repeal the CO2 tax: Trying to get done but the ALP is blocking so waiting till July when new senate sites
                                                                    4. Repeal the mining tax: see above
                                                                    5. the PPL: ( well not everyone is perfect)

                                                                    Those were the core policies and promises. in regards to this budget let me just say this hurts me bad in e short term. I have 4 children under 10 and am lower middle class. But I understand what Labour did was waste money. I am happy to have a go without the handouts because long term I will be better off as will my family. Also lets not forget the ALP LIED ABOUT THE DEFICIT AND DEBT. IT WAS ACTUALLY DOUBLE WHAT THEY SAID. SWANN's ASSUMPTION's were criminal. He project 12% growth in year 5 OUTSIDE THE ESTIMATES SO NOONE COULD SEE.

                                                                    Commenter
                                                                    Ethan
                                                                    Location
                                                                    Melbourne
                                                                    Date and time
                                                                    May 27, 2014, 11:24AM
                                                                  • Wow Ethan, it sounds like you are one of Howard's battlers. How interesting that you are happy to take on tax increases even though you are lower middle class, even though the people at the top aren't chipping in their fair share. You must be one of those people that think that making the rich richer will somehow make you richer. Sorrow to burst your bubble, but that's never happened in history.

                                                                    Commenter
                                                                    Tone
                                                                    Location
                                                                    Melbourne
                                                                    Date and time
                                                                    May 27, 2014, 11:34AM
                                                                  • The greatest trick the Liberals ever pulled was convincing Australia that a budget emergency exists.

                                                                    Commenter
                                                                    Tone
                                                                    Location
                                                                    Melbourne
                                                                    Date and time
                                                                    May 27, 2014, 11:37AM
                                                                  • Tone, the fact is just over 2% of Australia is what you would call wealthy. you could tax them 70% and it wouldn't make a dent in the deficit or debt. the great majority of OECD citizens are lower middle class through upper middle class to the tune 85% of people inclusive of Australians. Who do you think has to pay for Labour MESS!! also what the LNP, Economist, and the independent PBO are saying is the emergency lies in current spending. If we don't reign it in now then we are headed down the path of the US/UK and dare I say Greece. Do you want that type of debt in 10 or 20 years. Think of the CHILDREN WON"T YOU!!

                                                                    Commenter
                                                                    Ethan
                                                                    Location
                                                                    Melbournew
                                                                    Date and time
                                                                    May 27, 2014, 11:50AM
                                                                  • Actually, quoting that bastion of right thiunking, "The Oz", which is, no doubt, your source, Bowen refuted that there was no emergency but did so "I don’t think that’s a fiction at all, but neither am I saying that we have an immediate emergency." Bit of an oxymoron but it doesn't support the Coalition's panic position either, does it?

                                                                    Commenter
                                                                    stevek
                                                                    Location
                                                                    Sydney
                                                                    Date and time
                                                                    May 27, 2014, 11:56AM
                                                                  • Slow down a bit Ethan, you are stripping over your own words here. We elect government to govern according to their manifesto or promises or mandate if you like. Now the current government promised us a unity ticket on health, education (Gonski) and NDIS and welfare. Guess what: they ditched all of those in the name of budget emergency. An emergency by their own making - not left by Labor. The LNP went into the last election knowing full well the state of the economy via the PEFO (http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-08-13/pefo-released-by-treasury-and-finance/4883392). This PEFO is Costello legacy, a time bomb if you like set to blow up on any lying coming government. Guess what Abbott just triggered it.

                                                                    Commenter
                                                                    Mais51
                                                                    Location
                                                                    Sydney
                                                                    Date and time
                                                                    May 27, 2014, 11:57AM
                                                                  • So Ethan, you are suggesting that it is acceptable that we don't tax the wealthy at all? Your assertion is ridiculous. They need to put in their fair share as well, and not this short term band-aid rubbish. The problem is that the upper middle class are paying more tax for 3 years, but the upper class are paying zero. Just the way the Liberals like it.

                                                                    Commenter
                                                                    Tone
                                                                    Location
                                                                    Melbourne
                                                                    Date and time
                                                                    May 27, 2014, 12:06PM
                                                                  • Mais51, I agree but you are wrong as are so many people when it cmes to what was promised. Go back and watch the debates again. What the LNP promised was no cuts to health and education. What is funded now will be funded under the LNP. Any changes would be taken to the next election. Now look at the changes
                                                                    Gonski is fully funded this term. the funding cuts are to the next election
                                                                    Health. Is fully funded. the cuts in funding are after the next election
                                                                    the penision age rises in 20 years

                                                                    Now granted the LNP have broken their tax promises in relation to the fuel excise and 2% increase on the wealthy BUT the no Cuts to health or education THIS TERM is being kept.

                                                                    Also, in regards to the budget honesty. ?Year 5 was not apart of the documents and that is were Swann hid everything.

                                                                    Commenter
                                                                    Ethan
                                                                    Location
                                                                    Melbounre
                                                                    Date and time
                                                                    May 27, 2014, 12:23PM
                                                                  • TONE, WHAT???the 2% levy is on every penny above $180,000. What do you term upper middle class. Also, How much percentage should upper and upper middle class people pay? Seriously...These people will be paying 47% of their higher earnings. Should they pay 50%, 60% 70%. What is fair to you?

                                                                    Commenter
                                                                    Ethan
                                                                    Location
                                                                    Melbounre
                                                                    Date and time
                                                                    May 27, 2014, 12:30PM
                                                                • Good to see Snowdon working ever so hard for his constituents who have some of the worst social, health and education outcomes in the country.

                                                                  Commenter
                                                                  Nulla
                                                                  Date and time
                                                                  May 27, 2014, 10:51AM
                                                                  • Tony Abbott & Labor be warned. Thanks to his nickel holdings and soaring nickel prices, Clive Palmer will be well and truly cashed-up in time for the next election and able to fund a concerted campaign in both Houses. Clive could easily become the de-facto PM by having the balance of power in both Houses as disaffected voters from both major parties and candidates flock to support his party. Clive Palmer is Tony Abbott's just reward for making the last Parliament such a shambles that any jumped- up, self-opinionated billionaire thought he could do a better job. http://www.businessspectator.com.au/news/2014/5/23/resources-and-energy/palmers-net-worth-soars-nickel-price

                                                                    Commenter
                                                                    mitch of ACT
                                                                    Date and time
                                                                    May 27, 2014, 10:49AM
                                                                    • Without doubt Abbott was the most successful opposition leader in recent times; therefore, we should understand that the thinking behind that success extends to achieving a prolonged period in government. The recent budget, the lies, broken promises, not to mention his deceits by stealth contradict any hope of another term in government for Abbott. Clearly something does not fit; the obvious contradiction requires more than a cursory dismissal of Abbott’s long term plans as P.M.

                                                                      Firstly almost everything that Abbott has done has hurt workers, pensioners and those on CentreLink payments, basically Labor supporters. Meanwhile he has left his support base: Catholic hierarchy, employers, middle income earners and the wealthy relatively untouched by his imposts.

                                                                      Secondly he has created a myth of massive unprecedented debt that will take years to deal with, Hockey promised on 24 Apr 2014 a surplus of 1% of GDP by 2024”. By 2024 our GDP will be about $2010 billion, realising a $20.1 billion surplus in ten years’ time. So apart from Morrison stopping the boats what can Abbottism produce to win an election in 2016? Everything about Abbott points to something tucked up his sleeve

                                                                      Thirdly it all comes down to Hockey’s ability to blow smoke rings around the fiscal situation creating so much smoke one cannot ascertain what the plot actually is. Despite what the pundits claim I am of the opinion that Abbott has set himself up to produce a small budget surplus prior to the next election.

                                                                      You see stopping the boats is already a dead issue more or less, so what else has Abbott got other than his much vaunted claim of his superior fiscal management skills? It could mean more pain for Labor supporters.

                                                                      Commenter
                                                                      Pen of hrba
                                                                      Date and time
                                                                      May 27, 2014, 10:40AM
                                                                      • Don't worry. The Libs will engineer some crisis that only they can resolve.

                                                                        Commenter
                                                                        mitch of ACT
                                                                        Date and time
                                                                        May 27, 2014, 10:58AM
                                                                      • Pen, if brutality and inhumanity are the means of stopping boat people then yes they did. Nothing too hard about it, the real issue is how do you do it without selling your humanity.

                                                                        Commenter
                                                                        Mais51
                                                                        Location
                                                                        Sydney
                                                                        Date and time
                                                                        May 27, 2014, 11:07AM
                                                                      • I agree, Pen. The rabbit out of the hat will be a small surplus in 2016 closely followed by an election. And it will be achieved on the back of non-Liberal supporters. Meanwhile family trusts, super perks and fuel levies to miners will be untouched, and the mining super-profits tax axed.

                                                                        And best of all, Rupert will be pleased.

                                                                        Commenter
                                                                        Gigondas
                                                                        Date and time
                                                                        May 27, 2014, 11:14AM
                                                                    • So Eric Abetz has had a stint on a chicken farm? Should qualify him as chief wrangler of all the headless ninnys in the party room this morning.

                                                                      Commenter
                                                                      David D
                                                                      Location
                                                                      Ettalong Beach
                                                                      Date and time
                                                                      May 27, 2014, 10:30AM
                                                                      • Fair go, why isn't there a parliamentary dogs body available to open Clive' s doors on his Rolls?

                                                                        Commenter
                                                                        Pen of hrba
                                                                        Date and time
                                                                        May 27, 2014, 10:15AM
                                                                        • 9.52 am; Note to Senators Wong and Faulkner: *Spill and Fill* is actually an all-encompassing term pertaining to food, drinks and wallets at Grabbalition fundraisers.

                                                                          Commenter
                                                                          David D
                                                                          Location
                                                                          Ettalong Beach
                                                                          Date and time
                                                                          May 27, 2014, 10:07AM
                                                                          • Wong and Faulkner don't know what a spill and fill is? why don't they ask Rudd/Gillard and then have a chat to 40% Bill Shorten and 60% Albanese. Really, when will Wong take off her blinkers and when will Faulkner give up and retire to write a book or something.

                                                                            Commenter
                                                                            enough is enough
                                                                            Date and time
                                                                            May 27, 2014, 10:05AM
                                                                              • What did Wong and Faulkner call the sacking of 12,000 public servants via ALP "efficiency dividends" in the last ALP budget??

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                Andie
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 10:36AM
                                                                            • And, according to Bill Shorten the budget will take us to a "meaner, colder, harsher place". So prison ships as Abbott government public policy is not so far-fetched at all.

                                                                              Commenter
                                                                              Pluto
                                                                              Location
                                                                              Melbourne
                                                                              Date and time
                                                                              May 27, 2014, 9:51AM
                                                                              • The physicists call this entropy, Pluto.
                                                                                Entropy (S = KLogW) is the steady deterioration of society - its tendency to go from order to disorder. Fortunately, S can be slowed or halted by the re-installation of a decent, humanitarian Labor government.

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                Entropy
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 10:57AM
                                                                              • Fair enough Pluto, but where on this good earth would we find a DECENT Labor government? None to be found at the moment.

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                Cwitty
                                                                                Location
                                                                                Sydney
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 11:19AM
                                                                              • They have two years to replace their leader, and present a viable alternative to this rabble.
                                                                                Meanwhile, S increases at an alarming rate.

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                Entropy
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 11:48AM
                                                                            • Australia's government debt is relatively low compared to most basket-case countries of the world. But we're trying to catch up with the IMF saying our government debt has risen the fastest in the OECD in absolute terms & 3rd fastest as a percentage of GDP. But our AAA credit rating is secure thereby ensuring we only pay on average 4.5% interest on our debt. In the meantime the UK is paying on average 2.5% on their massive debt despite not having a AAA rating.

                                                                              But please don't let that stop us. Party on.

                                                                              Commenter
                                                                              Lewis
                                                                              Location
                                                                              Sydney
                                                                              Date and time
                                                                              May 27, 2014, 9:46AM
                                                                              • Lewis I am amazed at the people who want to keep borrowing $11 per week, $45 per month, $550 per year by every man women and child in Australia just to pay the interest on the ALP ever growing debt.

                                                                                And then they whinge about paying $7 to visit a doctor or 40 cents a week to fill their car.

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                Andie
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 10:43AM
                                                                              • Andie - the ALP Debt stopped in September - they didn't hand $8B to the Reserve Bank - but don't let the facts get in the way of a good story

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                Really ?
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 11:22AM
                                                                              • I am amazed by your comments Andie. You are pretty good at linking totally unrelated information.

                                                                                Let's sort out the debt per every man, woman and child nonsense. Tax paid by taxpayers ( adults, mostly Andie), is not supposed to be the only source of $ that repays debt. In fact, income tax is a minor part of Australia's income streams, although the Libs are working hear to minimise streams like the C and Mining Taxes.

                                                                                In fact, some economists say a reconstructed Mining Tax could bring us into surplus in 2 years and pay for our needed health infrastructure.

                                                                                Our debt is 12% of GDP. Increasing our income streams would mathematically decrease our debt. But the Libs prefer to do it by cutting funding to the most vulnerable in a inequitable, mean spirited and punitive way!

                                                                                Now the $7. To many the loss of $7 from a week's income places them in a situation of doing without food, postponing paying a bill ( eg electricity, gas) or denying a child permission to go on a school excursion because it can't be afforded. I am horrified by comments by Liberal pollies who repeatedly show that they are out oh touch with the poor and vulnerable. You too it seems are out of touch as well.

                                                                                The very poor just put one step in front of another, day by day, trying to make ends meet. They have no thoughts about debt per man, women or child. It is not relevant.

                                                                                But what is relevant is the $7 surcharge, the cuts to Family Tax Benefits A and B, the changes to Newstart for the under 30s and the untenable and difficult financial positions this government is putting them into.

                                                                                Plus the lies. The lies about the jobs that don't exist!!!

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                Tired of Spin
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 11:36AM
                                                                              • To really & Spin

                                                                                1. the ALP debt did DID NOT stop in September as we were borrowing $12 Billion a year just to pay the debt. For the ALP debt to stop they would have had to pay it all off.

                                                                                2. You cannot pay off debt when your expenditure exceeds your entire revenue year after year. That is why the ALP had an accumulated Deficit of $206 Billion over its budgets from 2008/09

                                                                                That is the ALP spent $200 billion more then they got from all sources of revenue.

                                                                                That is why we borrow $12 Billion a year just to pay INTEREST only on the ALP debt.

                                                                                Please give us all the link to an economist who says the MRRT would bring us to surplus in 2 years as several of our mines are closing as the coal price falls.

                                                                                Currently the MRRT is costing the government money as the revenue is negligible and the Tax office is repaying Millions to the mining companies who over paid their estimated tax.

                                                                                Please tell us of this money tree you seem to think exists above trax revenue????

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                Andie
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 1:30PM
                                                                              • AND... let's not forget the PROMISED mega-spending beyond the forward estimates in Gonski, NDIS, & bigger share of hospital funding. They're the ones that take the debt trajectory past $600Bn. Not a budget emergency perhaps but certainly a budget in serious structural disrepair.

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                Lewis
                                                                                Location
                                                                                Sydney
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 1:53PM
                                                                              • No-one suggests that staying in debt at all phases of the business cycle is sensible. No one at all. This is the kind of straw man the fringe erects to try to gloss over it's actual intention, which is further disadvantage for the less well off and further wealth creation for the rich.

                                                                                But if debt is small and rising quickly that still doesn't make for a concern. A debt can rise quickly from 0.5% to 0.6% but it's still 0.6%.

                                                                                You people don't get numbers.

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                RichardJ
                                                                                Location
                                                                                Sydney
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 1:59PM
                                                                            • Hacka, I suspect there will be quite a bit of 'chaos-driven rhetoric' in the Coalition party room meeting this morning. The backbenchers (and a lot of frontbenchers, apparently) are not happy.

                                                                              They're hoping, no doubt, that the cold winter ahead in Canberra might also bring a sense of perspective to Joe and Tony.

                                                                              Commenter
                                                                              Gigondas
                                                                              Date and time
                                                                              May 27, 2014, 9:44AM
                                                                              • Hmmmm. Lot of Coalition staffers at work on this site today - with their story lines and talking points on A4 sheets in front of them as they type in their bogus facts and figures. The point remains - we have the budget smuggler in charge of a Keystone Cops government that has become a laughing stock.

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                ALRowse
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 11:57AM
                                                                              • Actually Alrose, they get their bulletins from the Coalition Advisory Service. It provides them with all the information that they are supposed to promote for the day, regardless of whether its true.

                                                                                And it doesn't actually need to be a lot of people, either. They only need one or two people and a lot of aliases to make it look like there are more of them than there actually are.

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                Tone
                                                                                Location
                                                                                Melbourne
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 1:02PM
                                                                            • 9.05am Mumbles Abbott*s formerly dark blue tie has almost blanched to the colour of a surrender flag.Omen,perhaps?

                                                                              Commenter
                                                                              David D
                                                                              Location
                                                                              Ettalong Beach
                                                                              Date and time
                                                                              May 27, 2014, 9:43AM
                                                                              • The proud royal blue is certainly looking a bit wan. Notice Julie reaching for the stiletto in the background.

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                Gigondas
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 10:44AM
                                                                              • He's graduated to the "Silver Tie Set" going up in the world- no doubt a thank you pressie from the IPA.
                                                                                Trust he's listed it underneath the scholarship 'gift'.

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                A country gal
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 11:46AM
                                                                            • Historically interesting that Australia is running a prison ship of the coast of Christmas Island. Welcome to the nineteenth century.

                                                                              Commenter
                                                                              Pluto
                                                                              Location
                                                                              Melbourne
                                                                              Date and time
                                                                              May 27, 2014, 9:35AM
                                                                              • Perhaps we could moor some hulks on Lake Burley Griffin.

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                Gigondas
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 9:46AM
                                                                              • @Gigondas. Excellent idea. It would not he hard to fill.

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                Pluto
                                                                                Location
                                                                                Melbourne
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 10:06AM
                                                                              • @Gigondas. Sorry I misread. Some hulks you say. Plural. More than one. I guess parliamentarians like to have just that bit more room than the rest of us. After all who are we, just voters! Hulks with en suites.

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                Pluto
                                                                                Location
                                                                                Melbourne
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 10:18AM
                                                                              • More to come on this I expect. Prison ship for CI, floating hotel for MI.
                                                                                Obviously no need for a prison ship unless you have some prisoners to house.

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                A country gal
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 10:44AM
                                                                              • Hulks you say? There is no plural when it comes to 'The Hulk'. whatever you do don't make him angry.. you wont like him when he is angry. :)

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                Cwitty
                                                                                Location
                                                                                Sydney
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 11:08AM
                                                                              • I think you're being too chronologically charitable to this lot.

                                                                                I'm going 18th century.

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                Redsaunas
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 2:20PM
                                                                            • Well how about that – the ALP have decided that they will support the FTB freeze for two years. A small concession, but a concession nonetheless. Not sure what’s changed from the chaos-driven rhetoric of the last two weeks, maybe the cold winter ahead in Canberra has brought a sense of perspective.

                                                                              Surely this isn’t preparing the ground for a shift in the real inhibitor of jobs, growth and exports – the policy that’s cost a Labor a Prime Minister, an election, and has polarised public opinion for three years - the crazy carbon tax ?

                                                                              Commenter
                                                                              Hacka
                                                                              Location
                                                                              Canberra
                                                                              Date and time
                                                                              May 27, 2014, 9:03AM
                                                                              • maybe Hacka the ALP have just realised that because they will not repeal the carbon tax there will be an ALP Shorten Tax rise of 7 cents per litre in the excise on diesel for heavy transport on July 1 2014 and the $500,000,000 impact on the economy ..

                                                                                There will also be an increase in the Shorten ALP Carbon price with flow through the economy

                                                                                Feel a change on the fuel excise rise coming on or support for the ALP election promise to "terminate the carbon tax"?

                                                                                Nah ALP don't eep election promises.

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                Andie
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 9:30AM
                                                                              • Well your enthusiasm is a bit premature it seems:
                                                                                9:25AM: Jenny Macklin: "Labor will not support a freeze to any family tax benefit payment rate, we want to make it clear to those families in Australia ... that Labor will stand up for them."

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                stevek
                                                                                Location
                                                                                Sydney
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 9:36AM
                                                                              • Okay stevek - looks like it's "stop the votes".

                                                                                A very confused opposition, who's actually speaking for them ?

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                Hacka
                                                                                Location
                                                                                Canberra
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 9:50AM
                                                                              • Well, Hacka, not the leaks and rumours lot (probably including Lib tacticians and their busy workers, like you), it seems. I would think that Jenny Macklin was a reputable source of Labor policy, wouldn't you?

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                Tired of Spin
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 10:57AM
                                                                              • @Hacka - it just shows they are prepared to support reasonable policies that follow their core beliefs. The part B is a middle class welfare payment that I know personally is used by people earning lots of money and who don't need the financial support. It has become what Joe would call an "entitlement" and by supporting the means test just brings it into line with the core labor philosophy of looking out for the less well off while not giving handouts to people who can afford to do without them.

                                                                                Yes I can hear people saying but they need the money. No they don't. They need to prioritise their spending and not rely on government handouts which they believe they are entitled to. If we expect pensioners to give something up then people earning much more should also give something up as well.

                                                                                It is a good example of where a cut still protects the less well off while still saying lots of money. I expect that is why the opposition supports it.

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                Lance
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 10:58AM
                                                                              • @Hacka - which is it? Do you want them to support the governments policies or not? You can't have it both ways or is your position based solely on the amount of spin you an get out of it? No wonder the government can sleep well while being deceitful and full of lies - they don't actually stand for anything other than anything that will continue their travel entitlements.

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                Lance
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 11:01AM
                                                                              • So you wrongly state Labor's position on the FTB and when your own confusion or is that deliberate misrepresentation, is pointed out, in your mind that means Labor is confused.

                                                                                Any confusion by Labor is exceeded by the confusion LNP has created by the difference between the rhetoric and the budget reality.

                                                                                Heavy lifting by all - not so much. Budget emergency - not really as surplus not being achieved until 2017/18, after Labor would have achieved this. Deficit/debt needs to be immediately paid down as befitting a fiscal crisis - not really - see point about surplus and new spending measures, extra jets, PPL, research fund, neither medicare rebate reduction nor excise increase being used to reduce debt.

                                                                                Abbott who appears to be the one with the brain fog. He cannot even get the details of a major budget measure correct - that existing Uni students will pay the new fees rather than being grandfathered as Abbott "confused" it. Or just another example of deliberate deception to make the medicine go down?

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                Lyn
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 11:21AM
                                                                              • ToS, Lance and Lyn - i would have thought that Mark Kenny was a reputable source of Labor policy, he wrote the article pretty confidently stating the ALP position this morning.

                                                                                Looks like you guys didn't read it, but Judith referenced it at 9:25. You might want to have a read.

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                Hacka
                                                                                Location
                                                                                Canberra
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 11:31AM
                                                                              • @Hacka - how about reading my comment? Is this just another deflection or are you just spouting out verbage regardless of what the people have written. How about a fact based reasoned argument for a change?

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                Lance
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 12:53PM
                                                                              • Hacka,

                                                                                you weren’t confused. I can admit that wasn't so.

                                                                                “A very confused opposition, who's actually speaking for them?” Unnamed sources reported without attribution in Kenny’s article do not speak for Labor. Unnamed sources do not “speak” for any Party. I thought you would have been around long enough Hacka to know that they do not.

                                                                                The more interesting, but still a side issue, is why you felt it necessary to attribute confusion to Labor over the difference between some unattributed and therefore unauthoritative information that is clearly not official party position and its official position on FTB B announced by its official spokesperson on social security and families?

                                                                                Not sure exactly what you mean by “Okay stevek - looks like it's "stop the votes".

                                                                                But if it means Labor’s stance will lose it votes, then only in the propaganda manifesto of LNP HQ and the thinking of its rusted ons, is Labor’s stance against FTB B indexation freezing a vote loser for Labor, amongst those affected.

                                                                                Admittedly enough sheeple were duped in September so it may be that they can again be fooled that LNP will act/ is acting fairly and in their best interests generally and with this measure specifically.

                                                                                And noted that you have not addressed my point about the LNP’s own confusing contradictions between its fiscal rhetoric and the messages and measures in the budget.

                                                                                Commenter
                                                                                Lyn
                                                                                Date and time
                                                                                May 27, 2014, 2:40PM
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